ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1970 Mustang => Topic started by: HDAshmore on February 05, 2017, 06:58:14 PM
-
Is a 1970 Sportsroof with a 250 CI 6 cylinder and C4, scarce enough to make it worth the money to restore? I have a chance to pick one up with original motor and trans but did not know if they were desirable due to undesirable engine and are they low production. Only thing going for it is Décor group option and it is Metallic blue with white interior and unmolested. Just wanted some advice from the experts before I think about diving in.
Thanks,
Dan
-
Dan,
If you're really interested in it you could get a Marti Report on it which will tell you all you need to know about it.
http://www.martiauto.com/martireports.cfm
Matt
-
Matt,
Thanks I already have, I just don't know if the value restored is more than what will have to be spent. Are they a good investment is probably a better question to ask.
v/r
Dan
-
Thanks I already have, I just don't know if the value restored is more than what will have to be spent.
If its a true restoration few cars are worth what you put into them. Almost everything depends on what you buy the car for since that is one of the few things (as far as cost go) you have control over.
Are they a good investment is probably a better question to ask.
I would say no but like above most of these cars are not "good investments" when compared other options Buy what you like and will enjoy owning and looking at day or week after week. If you focus on how much you have in a car and just that you will see it as a hole in the ground you continue to dump money in.
Now making money on cars is a different thing. I take investments as ownership over time.
Everything depends on the deal and we don't have any real information to base a determination on at this point IMHO
-
$1750 with possibly no wrecks or molestation. Have located original motor and tranny. Needs typical rust work but rockers, torque boxes, pillars and cowl all look solid.
0 1970
F Built at Dearborn
02 Mustang 2-Door SportsRoof
L 250-1V I-6 Engine
production at Dearborn
06/70 June, 1970
63B Mustang 2-Door SportsRoof
6 Bright Blue Metallic Paint, Ford #3077-A
TW White Knitted Vinyl Bucket Seats
3 2.79 Conventional Rear Axle
W C-4 Select Shift Automatic Transmission
41 Chicago DSO (District Sales Office)
Your vehicle was equipped with the following features:
- E78X14 Belted White Sidewall Tires
- AM Radio
- Decor Group
- Wheel Covers
I think it would be fun to make back to original, it would look really nice and would be wife and kid friendly minus no PS and PDB but fun for local car shows I guess.
I appreciate all the input so far, good information is priceless, please keep educating me with your advice.
v/r
Dan
-
Dan,
Looks like a no frills/plain jane '70. There's nothing wrong with having said car as most are unless you have a pre-production, Shelby, GT, or Mach 1. The color combination sounds nice (blue exterior and white interior). My Mustang is a plain jane example too (5F07C395128) and as one who has gone through a full restoration several years ago, can attest that you won't get back what you put in it to restore it right. Sounds like a good buy. You can always add power steering and brakes later on down the road.
Matt
-
Money time and effort aside (that's likely still a consideration) the car would really stand out at a show IMHO if done well, but will bring some challenges with it since a 6 cylinder will be a bit of a challenge to locate original parts for (not expensive normally just not allot around) and doing the research.
-
Matt and Jeff,
Thank you for the advice and experience. I am not looking to build and flip. I was hoping the lack of desirable options and motor and the fact that the blue with white really look nice would make it a car that people would look at and go, Damn that is a pretty car with its little motor and all. My intention is usually to make it like the day it rolled out the door but I have never messed with a car like this. Kinda thinking it would be like the "it's so ugly it's cute" way of looking at it. I think for $1750 and locating the original drive train; that it is at least getting into at a decent price?
Once again, I appreciate all input, experience and encouragement.
Dan
-
Anyone know what 1970 Sportsroof, 6 Cylinder production numbers were? Just curious
-
So $1750 to start. Plus it appears that "an original" (instead of "the original" most likely) engine and transmission would be an extra cost.
When you say possible no wrecks or molestation, some would think that the fact that the engine and transmission were pulled and are gone equate to at least some level of molestation.
On top of that there is "typical" rust repair.
How much work are you willing and able to do yourself? How much will you need to farm out?
I would suggest getting pictures, and posting them here, to get comments before pulling the trigger.
Best of luck, John
-
Anyone know what 1970 Sportsroof, 6 Cylinder production numbers were? Just curious
According to Mustang by the Numbers
T codes w/automatic = 427 (561 with 3 speed)
L codes w/automatic = 1716 (1113 with 3 speed)
-
Thanks for the numbers on the production. I have found "the" original motor and transmission (250 CI and C4) just down the road from the car. It appears there were not a lot of them made although not rare, at least uncommon, and with a nice color combination and Décor option. With everyone's input I think it is in the realm of give it a shot. However, I will get some pics here soon and post as that just makes since.
Thanks again
Dan
-
Sending photos is an excellent idea so that you can have more input from this Forum. There is no doubt that this was, and could be a very nice looking car. But with only about 3,000 I6 engines sold in 1970, NOS, used or reproduction parts will be more difficult to locate than a V8. I looked up the Haggerty value of a 1970 I6/auto Sportsroof and here is what came up: #1 Concours (so assume an MCA Gold winner type condition) $20,740, #2 Excellent Condition $14,195. Before you put down the money for the body and the separated engine and transmission I would recommend looking through the NPD or Virginia Mustang catalog (or any other reputable supplier) and just make up a list of parts needed to complete the car, add in paint and body work either done by you or someone else and see what the total is. If you are comfortable with the number then go right ahead and have fun, if not, locate something else.
-
Building 3,
Great advice and thanks for putting it in perspective. I will see it in a couple of weeks and take and post pics. I know I have to do a lions share of the work myself to not be upside down and then still a crap shoot. I was assuming this would be all refurbished OEM and aftermarket parts to stay reasonably affordable vs value.
Thanks all
-
Dan
Is the body in need of rust repair? After having completed the repairs on my '70 Mach 1 I swore I would never restore another '70 sportsroof again because good used quarters are sooooo hard to find, repops are not that good and NOS are astronomically expensive and rare. Good luck and why not start a build thread we can follow?
-
Mark,
Thanks for the warning on quarters. As for the build thread. I would love to but more for people seeing what I am doing and stopping me from doing something stupid or costly and me getting their great advice. I would probably benefit more from the thread unless comedic value counts then maybe it would be a quid pro quo for the forum members. Actually, I am only thinking of this mustang as an opportunity to not pass up at that price. I think if I let it go, someone will buy it and turn it into something it was not or cut it up to fix their car. I am struggling with that. I actually have a 1970 Grabber Blue Mach 1 sitting in the garage that I want to do and have been collecting parts for. So having said that, maybe I might try to start a build thread for it and then the other one down the road.
Once again any thoughts, ideas or advice are always welcome and very appreciated as they are free and mistakes are costly.
v/r
Dan
-
Do the Mach 1 in the garage.
The 6 cylinder sport roof car with its issues would be too expensive and time consuming to restore, even if you got it for free.
-
or just do a "Resale Red" (but in blue metalic ;) ) repaint and interior sharpen-up and put it up for sale. Just do the job budget-minded, not Restoration minded, you may profit a grand or two and gain some knowledge for your Mach build
-
Ok Dan (it sounds like WE are the other angel (or devil) on your shoulder) ! LOL From reading a few times from you words like Money spent/value, good investment and even worse Wife and Kid friendly. So my imput will be coming from a different side (one that isn't emotionally involved with "saving every car".
I think we all know that that car is on the bottom of the food chain for collecablity, interest or future resale. (as sits, repaired or reselling the hour after you buy it). It takes the same amount of effort to weld, paint and BUY PARTS for that car as it does for a Boss 302, 428CJ etc etc.
Seeing you have a car that you haven't started to work on (100%) MY GUESS is "time and money" (read family and work) haven't allowed for progess the way you (or your wife) has wanted. Yes you are chomping at the bit to "resore something" but that is where you can't make more time or money. If you haven't resotored 5 or 6 cars in the last 10 years chances of doing so get less and less as time goes on! (Economy changes/life changes/AGE).
I?WE can see MANY REASONS (above) not to but here is one that has effected me MANY TIMES (and some others too I'll guess).............so SO often I have bought a car or project and "the next day/week/month" a BETTER, rarer (rear more profitable car) come along! (you then have to buy that too) 13 Mustangs later and your wife is really on your ass to "get those cars sold"!
Mark
P.S. Love reading you repies and noted the respect for "comedic valve" so here goes. "Nancy Regan"
-
Mark,
That has to be some of the best damn advice/reality check I have received yet. I really appreciate that! This damn car just keeps knawing at me. Like that darn last, sad, ugly, puppy sitting in the Wal-Mart parking lot, long after all its siblings have been taken to a new home. You want to save it! I know this car will never be worth a bunch and never command a price. I think it would just be a fun counter weight to do where aftermarket parts do not matter so much as they would on my Mach 1, rebuilding a smaller cheaper motor, less parts to track, scrutinize and restore to perfection. I think of this more as "polishing a turd!" I'll never be able to mask its nasty stench "(6cyl)", but I think I can polish this turd until it blinds the unsuspecting oogler until they open the hood and get a wiff. You are right, it will sit for awhile until I can get priorities strait. Just retired after 25+ in the Army. Wife let me get the Mach as a retirement project only after I went and got another job, go figure! So, yes time is split between what I want to do and what I have to do. I don't think I am losing anything if it just sits and I have no expectation to buy and flip. I will try to get some pics in the next week or two, as it is literally sitting in a barn, yes an actual barn find, if a 6 cylinder can be called that legally!
I really like this site, its wonderful members and all their great advice and stories.
v/r
Dan
aka "Future Turd Polisher" (FTP)
-
Well I'm glad your LIKED my response ! And glad you didn't take offence -none was meant!
Now I'm really going to mess with your mind. It's is funny I spend more time looking at a 6cyl (with rare intakes, carbs and headers) at a show than I do at any other cars. (mostly because you don't see Cliford manifolds and stromberg carbs everyday)!
Having said that 6cyl or not IT WILL COST MONEY and take away time.
It sounds like "herder sydrome" (not horder). It is what you love them so much you want to save everyone one. Common with Corvair, Vega and Metropolitan owners. Then again SAAB, Triumph MG etc etc.
Mark
P.S. Did you get the "Nancy Regan" line?
-
I am still trying to figure it out. Was it the last name spelling and if so I am at a loss? I love a good joke or riddle but I am officially stumped.
-
Yeah sorry Nancy Reagan ! "just say no" My vote on the car.
Mark
-
Duh! I should of caught that one as it flew over my head. That is so my generation. I was thinking like Ronald Reagan, the more nukes the better!
So several have advised to run away. I may have to reevaluate and let the thing go. Well no one is holding a gun to my head and I have until beginning of March to decide.
So even with the numbers correct factory original motor and trans, and me taking me sweet old time doing the work myself, and using old OEM, used and aftermarket parts, and it being a medium blue metallic, with white deluxe interior with décor group, and only costing $1750, and I can't think of anything else to say to put lipstick on this pig, I should still walk away?
Hmmm. I will wait for the final consensus if I can get pics and post them soon. Aaaargh!
Cheers all,
Dan
-
Yeah sorry Nancy Reagan ! "just say no" My vote on the car.
It could have been Bill, who "never" said no.
Jim
-
Yes, but I bet "Slick Willie" not only liked the nice shiny paint jobs on his rides, he most likely always popped their hoods to see what was under there and checked the oil while he was there, just as a courtesy I'm sure. He was probably hitting on all 8 cylinders all the time and never messed with a crappy old 6 banger.
Disclaimer:All previous puns artfully and most ornerestly intended for your reading enjoyment.
Now I digress, back to my 6 banger. Can anyone recommend decent engine rebuild kits. I actually am asking for both this and my Mach 1 as both have their original motors. The 250 CI and my Mach 1 is 351C 4V with FMX, PS, PDB and AC, if it matters. Same would go for the Carbs and C4 and FMX. Maybe a better questions might be is there rebuild kits/companies to definitely stay away from? This is down the road for me but I am a planner and always watching for a good deal and would hate to miss pulling the trigger on something due to inexperience or ignorance.
Thanks again for all the great jocularity and more importantly advice.
v/r
Dan
-
Dan,
While I've lurked on this website for years, I've recently started posting here as well. One bit of information that seems to keep being missed in the cost of restoration projects like you are contemplating is that it is what I've always referred to as one of the "Children of a Lesser God". The really nice original interior parts are shared with some non-Mach Cobra Jet sportsroofs, some BOSS 302 and 429 cars. Other than the drivetrain components you will be competing with owners of the "higher" grade cars for parts and lots of times those owners will spend more than they should for parts. I know I have.
Now I used quotation marks for the "higher" grade cars and also for the "Children of a Lesser God" remarks. I think that your car blue with the White interior would be very pretty car. Yes it would stand out. Good luck with it.
-
Update.
This car will be delivered to the farm tomorrow afternoon. Too good a deal to let walk away. I will post pics soon and start thinking about what to do with it.
v/r
Dan
-
The car now comfortably reside at a new Kansas farm. Behold the 6 banger in all it's Kansas wheat field dust and glory. What to do now?
v/r
Dan