Author Topic: Front seat belt hardware  (Read 847 times)

Offline Angela

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Front seat belt hardware
« on: November 29, 2014, 11:31:20 AM »
I am confused about the hardware which is supposed to be used with 67 SanJose fastback seat belts. I've searched this forum, reviewed the assembly diagrams and compared that information with that obtained from AMK and Python. The AMK front seat belt hardware kit only comes with TWO rubber washes, yet the assembly manual calls for EIGHT rubber washers.

Can someone please help me understand the following:

A. Front Retractors
(1) Is there supposed to be a large metal washer underneath the carpet, between the retractor and the body?
(2) Beginning with the bolt head, what comes next? Bolt -- rubber washer? --- retractor--- another rubber washer OR a metal washer? ---- carpet ---- large metal washer?

B. Front belts (female end)
(1) Is there supposed to be a large metal washer underneath the carpet, between the retractor and the body?
(2) Beginning with the bolt head, what comes next? Bolt -- rubber washer? --- seat belt--- another rubber washer OR a metal washer? ---- carpet ---- large metal washer?

Offline Angela

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2014, 05:02:49 PM »
OK, could someone at least tell me if there is supposed to be a washer *beneath* the carpet, where the anchor bolt goes through? If yes, it would seem I need to remove the sill scuff plates again. I just don't understand what the exploded view is trying to tell me. The AMK kit provides four LARGE washers and I am wondering where these go.

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2014, 07:48:33 PM »
OK, could someone at least tell me if there is supposed to be a washer *beneath* the carpet, where the anchor bolt goes through?

Seems that your frustration is showing though your post.

Sorry don't have any pictures (did check) of this detail - no surprise in this case, and I don't have a 67 here to check so all I can offer is a general comment based on what we find in other models and years.  You'll have to choose what to follow or maybe someone else has their car apart.

Often I've found on the 67-up years a steel washer between the carpet and the floor. Don't believe the small diameter red dye washers started till 68. Can't recall if rubber insulating washers were used on 67's with the retractors though the assembly drawing seems to suggest one above and one below the belt attachment point.
Jeff Speegle

Anything worth doing is worth doing concours ;)

Offline Angela

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #3 on: November 30, 2014, 10:08:02 AM »
Thanks Jeff. You're perceptive, yes, I am frustrated and apparently allowed that to come through my post. My apologies if I offended anyone.

I didn't find any washers between the carpet and seat belt when I disassembled this car, but the assembly manual and your observations seem to indicate a washer should have been at this location. I wish  I had known this before installing the center console. I doubt it is still possible to install a washer beneath the carpet after I have installed the console. Ugh.

Online 67gtasanjose

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #4 on: November 30, 2014, 10:46:13 AM »
... I doubt it is still possible to install a washer beneath the carpet after I have installed the console. Ugh.

I really doubt you need to remove anything to get this done correctly, hopefully others can chime in with a preferred method of assembly but just in my own opinion, It would seem that you ought to be able to stretch the hole to get the original style washers under the carpeting. I'm not sure the AMK washers are correct, maybe if you have pictures of what was provided or what you intend to use there.

I have been following this thread mostly since I removed the original carpeting so long ago (like 1978), so I wouldn't be able to say how everything was/is supposed to be. What I do seem to remember was the washers went below the seat belts as a spacer and I believed they stayed under when the carpet was removed, a few were stuck to the carpeting with some sort of sealer.  If this is consistent to what the assembly manual and other examples indicate, it would make sense that the washers were pushed through the hole (was the hole possibly pre-cut on OE carpets?) and stuck in place with sealant to the floor panel or supported in place with the notch-out in the underlayment, then the bolt inserted with a sealant. 

Richard
« Last Edit: November 30, 2014, 10:48:33 AM by 67gtasanjose »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Well Optioned
2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline Fastback2013

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #5 on: November 30, 2014, 11:17:39 AM »
I am trying to give you as much correct information as I can, but I own just 1 car so I don't know if it is 100% correct
In attachment you have 'picture 1' that gives you an overall view of the car.
Picture 2 gives you a close up of the bolt at the tunnel seen from the passenger side.
Then you have a picture 'driver side', where you can see the 2 bolts for the retractor and female end from the front belt
The picture 'passenger side', gives you also a general view of the 2 bolts but at the passenger side.
I just describe what I have found on my car, so I am not sure that it is the whole Truth but there isn't much done at my car over all those years....
Where the retractor goes, you have the chassis then a steel washer, the carpet, the rubber washer and than the bolt.
At the tunnel, where the female end goes from the belt, you have the tunnel, steel washer, carpet and than the bolt (so no rubber washer there)

I have also purchased the AMK kit nr. F-3560 (Seat belts Front), so I can compare the old stuff with the new.
The bolts are identical, so that's 100% correct
The rubber washers (4 pieces in my kit) are a bit thicker as the originals, but that can (probably) be explained that the bolts and rubber washer has been tightend for so many years. But in the kit there are 4, in my car just 2
In the kit there are 2 kinds of steel washers :
1/ bare steel (4 pieces) : diam = 1 7/32 inch (original one is diam = 63/64 inch / the whole in the middle is exact the same (= 29/64 inch), also the thickness is the same
2/ zinc yellow plated (2 pieces) : diam = 55/64 inch (no original found on my car)
In attachment also a picture of the old and new bolts and washers.

When I look in the Osborn interior assembly manual, at page 40 (seat section) I see at sectional view BB there is a washer at the tunnel (behind the carpet) and then the bolt, so that looks correct with was done in my car, accept that the washer is described as finish phosphate and lubricant, but it was in bare steel.
When you look view DD at the same page of the Osborn manual than there is a steel washer at the chassis (that must bed phosphate and lubricant, the carpet, steel washer (in plain steel), the retractor, steel washer (in plain steel) and then the bolt.
In the manual there is no speaking of a washer in rubber....

So knowing that, we can perhaps say that the AMK kit is correct that they provide the 2 extra washers (diam 55/64 inch)?
But the finish isn't correct according the Osborn manual, but is correct with the finish of the parts that came out of my car.

I hope that this will help you a bit further, but I can't say what you must do or not.
Within a few months I have the same problem as you have now  ;)
But there are persons, like Jeff and others, that have way more experience than I have for helping us further.

Kind regards,
Jeroen
San Jose 7R02C1708xx
Fastback GTA
built on 01/12/1967

Offline TLea

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #6 on: November 30, 2014, 05:20:34 PM »
I typically see Shelbys so bolt/ washer configuration would be different but generally there is a thick steel washer under carpet on tunnel bolts and on rear seat belt bolts sometimes
Tim Lea  Shelby concours judge MCA, SAAC, Mid America

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #7 on: November 30, 2014, 06:08:47 PM »
On other applications the washer is way too large to be installed from the top of the carpet

This example is from a 70 Dearborn

« Last Edit: November 30, 2014, 06:15:03 PM by J_Speegle »
Jeff Speegle

Anything worth doing is worth doing concours ;)

Offline C6ZZGT

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Re: Front seat belt hardware
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2017, 11:32:41 PM »
Does anyone have an update on this question/issue ? Since the wifes car was apart already i have the same question about reinstalling belts. hers is a 05F 67 san jose coupe with deluxe belts.
Brian
66 GT Coupe 6R07A143871 owned since 1983
35+ yr partsman,over 20 with Ford.