Author Topic: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details  (Read 521 times)

Offline J_Speegle

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67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« on: August 10, 2017, 05:25:27 PM »
Along the "lines" of discussion of underhood items, particularly the valves that connect the lines to the compressor (including the associated caps)...
....

Wasn't the 67 that we looked at a few years back and came up with allot of originals with two styles of caps used originally and in a specific pattern. Forgive me if that was a different year.

Referring to the fill caps not the valve caps
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Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #1 on: August 10, 2017, 06:02:28 PM »
Wasn't the 67 that we looked at a few years back and came up with allot of originals with two styles of caps used originally and in a specific pattern. Forgive me if that was a different year.

Referring to the fill caps not the valve caps

I believe you are right and it looks like "OCD me" (from my younger years) switched them to 'match' so perhaps we can revisit this here again or if somebody stumbles onto the other thread, link it to this one.

I have also uploaded some pictures of my compressor and Hardware. It is possible some or all of this is incorrect for my November 2nd 66 built San Jose example. Before understanding date codes for example, I may have swapped this compressor out somewhere in the vehicle's life.
« Last Edit: August 10, 2017, 06:25:53 PM by 67gtasanjose »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Well Optioned
2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline krelboyne

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #2 on: August 10, 2017, 10:18:30 PM »
My research shows two different sets of service valves were used 1967-68. Not sure if they are York or Tecumseh related?
Service caps can be either brass or aluminum. *I matched mine to Richard's example.
I also am showing a picture of two styles of service valve caps, note that one has distinctly wider (taller?) knurling stamped into it.
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1968 GT/CS 302-4V San Jose 05B
1968 Cougar XR7 Dearborn 09A

Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #3 on: August 10, 2017, 10:45:57 PM »
I believe you are right and it looks like "OCD me" (from my younger years) switched them to 'match' so perhaps we can revisit this here again or if somebody stumbles onto the other thread, link it to this one.

I have also uploaded some pictures of my compressor and Hardware. It is possible some or all of this is incorrect for my November 2nd 66 built San Jose example. Before understanding date codes for example, I may have swapped this compressor out somewhere in the vehicle's life.
I have not seen that style clutch if of the eletro magnet variety painted completely black before when NOS or on survivor cars .  I have typically seen them plated silver with black rivets or also sometimes with some of the other features inside the inner center face blacked out but not completely black. I have seen them after being rebuilt paint all black rather then plated silver . If the clutch is of the brush variety I have only seen them as black.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 06:55:17 PM by Bob Gaines »
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Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #4 on: August 11, 2017, 04:56:49 AM »
I have not seen that style clutch painted completely black before when NOS or on survivor cars .  I have typically seen them plated silver with black rivets or also sometimes with some of the other features inside the inner center face blacked out but not completely black. I have seen them after being rebuilt paint all black rather then plated silver .

Thank you. Details like these are the toughest to duplicate. I have a Ford service replacement clutch that is also all black & assumed this was correct. It may be a remanufactured replacement. If anyone has pictures of these details, much appreciated.

FWIW, small block clutch details differ than big block clutches but I have not been able to pin down all of the differences yet. Too many restored & serviced cars, too few true survivors.
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Well Optioned
2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #5 on: August 11, 2017, 05:40:21 PM »
Thank you. Details like these are the toughest to duplicate. I have a Ford service replacement clutch that is also all black & assumed this was correct. It may be a remanufactured replacement. If anyone has pictures of these details, much appreciated.

FWIW, small block clutch details differ than big block clutches but I have not been able to pin down all of the differences yet. Too many restored & serviced cars, too few true survivors.
On review of the pictures I realize that I got your clutch style mixed up with the type that uses the electro magnet. The brush type style s painted black and the type that uses the electro magnet that I had it confused it with is silver. The faces are very similar. I amended my previous post.
« Last Edit: August 11, 2017, 06:56:18 PM by Bob Gaines »
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Offline J_Speegle

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #6 on: August 11, 2017, 06:16:34 PM »
Looked through original unrestored and period pictures and the only place I've finding 67 or 68 AC clutches for Mustang applications that are plated are service replacements

I have more than 100 examples from examples of both years so I'm only going to post a few (basically a nice example from each year and plant) to illustrate what I found 

7R03C1883xx



7T03A15238x



8F01C1794xx



8R01C12673x



8T02J1986xx





Also since the same clutches may have been used on the same pump when installed in other car models a few production car pictures from 67
Sorry some are pretty nasty scans.




Jeff Speegle

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Offline J_Speegle

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #7 on: August 11, 2017, 06:17:56 PM »
Shot of the valves and caps - this time from a 68


8R01C12673x
Jeff Speegle

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Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #8 on: August 11, 2017, 06:48:16 PM »
Looked through original unrestored and period pictures and the only place I've finding 67 or 68 AC clutches for Mustang applications that are plated are service replacements

I have more than 100 examples from examples of both years so I'm only going to post a few (basically a nice example from each year and plant) to illustrate what I found 

7R03C1883xx



7T03A15238x



8F01C1794xx



8R01C12673x



8T02J1986xx





Also since the same clutches may have been used on the same pump when installed in other car models a few production car pictures from 67
Sorry some are pretty nasty scans.




Jeff ,your  picture#3 is of the electro magnet variety and I feel have been painted as replacement parts.
Bob Gaines,Shelby enthusiast, Shelby collector , Shelby concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #9 on: August 11, 2017, 07:02:43 PM »
Jeff ,your  picture#3 is of the electro magnet variety and I feel have been painted as replacement parts.

Sure I can look and post a couple of other 68 Dearborn examples if that would help
Jeff Speegle

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Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #10 on: August 11, 2017, 07:28:01 PM »
Sure I can look and post a couple of other 68 Dearborn examples if that would help
It would be interesting if you would . Black painted contradicts what the Pitts style electromagnetic clutch is typically finished as. The 68 photos, factory and otherwise of 68 Metuchen Shelby's (it is a early vs late thing apparently)  and the 64/65 and 68 Pitts clutch versions (electro magnet) in Mannels book all appear to be plated too. It seems that there is at least some kind of consistency over the course of several years.  I wouldn't think the same manufacture supplying different plants would have a different finish for one (Dearborn) over the other plants . I suppose it could be a anomaly for a short period of time in 68.  There is quite a bit of picture documentation for the Pitts style clutch being silver on 69 Dearborn cars.  I don't think that Pitts had multiple plants but maybe that is it . Hate to put you to the trouble but if you are so inclined it would be interesting to see how much of a anomaly it is.   
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Offline J_Speegle

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2017, 12:24:02 AM »
It would be interesting if you would . Black painted contradicts what the Pitts style electromagnetic clutch is typically finished as. ..........

Just so I focus and get this right before the search ;)  Your only describing the finish on one style of AC clutch? As your referring to in reply #5

So we're all in agreement that the other style (appears that the electromagnetic was not used in 67 originally) was originally finished in semi-gloss black.

As for the electromagnetic style I know I've got NOS versions of those in the plated finish.  Will look to see what or how side the usage was for that style in 68 in my collection of pictures. Should only take less than an hour I would guess to go through everything I can think of
Jeff Speegle

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Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2017, 01:08:09 AM »
Just so I focus and get this right before the search ;)  Your only describing the finish on one style of AC clutch? As your referring to in reply #5

So we're all in agreement that the other style (appears that the electromagnetic was not used in 67 originally) was originally finished in semi-gloss black.

As for the electromagnetic style I know I've got NOS versions of those in the plated finish.  Will look to see what or how side the usage was for that style in 68 in my collection of pictures. Should only take less than an hour I would guess to go through everything I can think of
Yes, I have only seen the Eaton brush style painted black. I agree and don't think that the electro magnet style was used in 67. Yes on focus should be on finish of electro magnet style as pictured in reply 5 and your third picture in reply #6. 
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Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2017, 08:48:07 AM »
On review of the pictures I realize that I got your clutch style mixed up with the type that uses the electro magnet. The brush type style s painted black and the type that uses the electro magnet that I had it confused it with is silver. The faces are very similar. I amended my previous post.

Acknowledged.

Your answer sent me into a image search of previous threads at this site for unrestored examples and with the recent Photobucket tragedy/travesty...those thread's images are not yet available! (Jeff, disregard my other posts for the time being...take your time as is available).

With the un-availability of the unrestored images posted in other threads, balance 'in my universe' sure was upset! Thankfully, the correction of interpretation has resorted my sanity...Ok, temporarily restored my sanity!

Now on to the next task...I ordered the gaskets & seals to re-seal my compressor. My understanding is that the only real issues (failures) of over 90% of these York compressors is 1.) reed valve contamination & 2.) crankshaft seal leaks. Easy repairs for the novice...as long as you do not take the whole compressor apart that is. If anyone else has any pointers along these lines, feel free to share them. It might be later this year before I actually rebuild mine (unless I get a break at work and can take the time).

My thoughts at this time regarding the brush holder mounting plate is to replate the original C3SA-2979-A bracket (with FoMoCo script) and re-rivet it onto a replacement brush set. Most replacement NOS sets have C8 engineering numbers :( Aftermarkets look to be blank.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2017, 09:06:24 AM by 67gtasanjose »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Well Optioned
2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline Bob Gaines

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Re: 67-68 AC Engine Compartment Details
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2017, 02:21:42 PM »
Acknowledged.

Your answer sent me into a image search of previous threads at this site for unrestored examples and with the recent Photobucket tragedy/travesty...those thread's images are not yet available! (Jeff, disregard my other posts for the time being...take your time as is available).

With the un-availability of the unrestored images posted in other threads, balance 'in my universe' sure was upset! Thankfully, the correction of interpretation has resorted my sanity...Ok, temporarily restored my sanity!

Now on to the next task...I ordered the gaskets & seals to re-seal my compressor. My understanding is that the only real issues (failures) of over 90% of these York compressors is 1.) reed valve contamination & 2.) crankshaft seal leaks. Easy repairs for the novice...as long as you do not take the whole compressor apart that is. If anyone else has any pointers along these lines, feel free to share them. It might be later this year before I actually rebuild mine (unless I get a break at work and can take the time).

My thoughts at this time regarding the brush holder mounting plate is to replate the original C3SA-2979-A bracket (with FoMoCo script) and re-rivet it onto a replacement brush set. Most replacement NOS sets have C8 engineering numbers :( Aftermarkets look to be blank.
I agree with your strategy but would like to add because of others that may be reading is that only the very earliest of 67 production A/C cars would use the brush set with the C3SA engineering number. I actually have never noticed the C3SA brush set used before on a 67 production but it may be because your car is early production and Ford hadn't switched over yet.  The vast majority of 67 Brush sets are of the C7 variety. The C3,C7 brush sets can still be found in NOS form occasionally. The C8 is much more common relatively speaking.
Bob Gaines,Shelby enthusiast, Shelby collector , Shelby concours judge SAAC,MCA,Mid America Shelby