ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1964 1/2 - 1965 => Topic started by: J_Speegle on January 16, 2013, 07:29:37 PM
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Trying to see if I can determine some general or specific change over periods for each of the different firewall pads used at San Jose in 65.
We realize that the typical/normal pad was produced and supplied by a different sub contractor than the other plants (like many parts) characterized by a "dimpled" or "off set pegboard" surface
Major difference appears to be the punch outs for the AC hoses. So far I've got the
1- No punch out
2- Vertical oval ended punch out
3- Vertical square corner punch out
4- Horizontal (angled up at passenger end) oval ended punch out
Here are a few examples
No punch
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-070218174008.jpeg)
Some may notice the early clutch rod seal in the example below
Vertical oval ended punch out
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-040118204056.jpeg)
Vertical square corner punch out
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-040118203838.jpeg)
Horizontal (angled up at passenger end) oval ended punch out
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-031217153139.jpeg)
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Jeff,
My Oct 65 San Jose build "K" has an oval hole but it's at a 70 degree angle. It's too cold to take a picture tonight but I'll wrap myself in a parka and hit it tomorrow, along with my Oct 65 San Jose build hardtop. It's cold in Santa Clara - ;)
Jim
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Jeff,
My Oct 65 San Jose build "K" has an oval hole but it's at a 70 degree angle. It's too cold to take a picture tonight but I'll wrap myself in a parka and hit it tomorrow, along with my Oct 65 San Jose build hardtop. It's cold in Santa Clara - ;)
Jim
Being a 66 model I would expect you to have the #4 version - thanks
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The red '65 SJ convertible I'm putting together now is in the 206xxx range, it had the sideways oval punch-out for a/c lines. Something I noticed about that original firewall pad was it was a little more shiny than the earlier ones I have seen.
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Jeff,
My June '65 production GT350 has the vertical rectangular style punch out.
My late March '65 one has the same style.
The early Dec. '65 production GT350's that I have observed have the one without any punch out.
Oh, and anyone has one of the vertical rectangular SJ style ones, I sure could use a nice one!
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I took some photos of my November 64 SJ, A code coupe. DSO was Dallas. VIN# 156xxx. Appears to have been hacked so probably no cut out.
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Appears to have been hacked so probably no cut out.
October '64 SJ fastback... Same here. Mine looked like someone jabbed a screwdriver through it until there were big enough holes for the hoses, and then jabbed it some more for good measure.
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Here are pictures of my Oct 15, 1965 hardtop and Oct 18, 1965 K Fastback firewalls. Both are San Jose cars.
Jim
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Firewall pad picture from my early '66 Shelby #280.
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A picture of my San Jose May 11 build 65 GT Fastback, square cut vertical. Should we also look in the engine compartment for the corresponding A/C hoses' access?
Jim
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Those firewall pads just aren't san jose seen them in many early dearborn cars. Just took apart an original 64 1/2 pace car coupe built april 17th 1964 with the pad you show in the pictures
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Those firewall pads just aren't san jose seen them in many early dearborn cars. Just took apart an original 64 1/2 pace car coupe built april 17th 1964 with the pad you show in the pictures
Jeff does a lot of research on Mustangs. I don't know what his objective was in this case, I assume looking for a transition date from one type of pad to another, but specifically as installed in the San Jose assembly plant. His quest may apply to Shelbys for that matter. Owners of Mustangs from other plants my be asked to do a similar survey on pads or other components.
Jim
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This is from my Oct 18, (K 18) San Jose build '66 Convertible. Looks like a #4- horizontal oval to me too.
My firewall pad looks a bit different, in that it has the square imprint other than the dimple look- is it original?
6R08T120933
K18 (Oct 18, 1965)
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My firewall pad looks a bit different, in that it has the square imprint other than the dimple look- is it original?
Haven't seen one like that before.
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October '64 SJ fastback... Same here. Mine looked like someone jabbed a screwdriver through it until there were big enough holes for the hoses, and then jabbed it some more for good measure.
I looked at mine yesterday (Oct 1964 SJ) and i have two distinct round holes cut out in the firewall pad. I'll post a picture later when I get home...
Chris
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Here's my firewall pad:
(http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l283/shelbee350/Honey%20Gold%20-%20Mine/IMG-20130122-00806.jpg)
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Have seen that square type firewall pad used in fairlanes of the same vintage but never a mustang..... Bet a million bucks its probably a fairlane firewall pad that repurposed along the assembly line..
Tony Kovar
1966 Sprint 200 Registry
MCA#70001
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Have seen that square type firewall pad used in fairlanes of the same vintage but never a mustang..... Bet a million bucks its probably a fairlane firewall pad that repurposed along the assembly line..
Which surface pattern Tony?
Don't believe so (not sure if a Fairlane will even fit - didn't know the firewalls were interchangeable) seen a fair number of them out of San Jose . IF that was true why not do it from the beginning of production since it looks like that was the second version?
Just trying to identify what period at this point. Easy enough to take a Fairlane and a Mustang one and put one over the other to compare.
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Here's the pad for my Oct '64 K Fastback. A/C holes look hacked out. It was the victim on an add-on A/C.
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So far (unfortunately all of these may really have been built different months) we have three different pads (AC hose area) showing up on cars with projected dates of Oct 64.Sure appears that that period os a change over one between suppliers or at least a design change
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Are you going to do one on 66 SJ pads or are they all the same?
I have a pic of a 6R07C185xxx pad if you need it.
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Are you going to do one on 66 SJ pads or are they all the same?
I have a pic of a 6R07C185xxx pad if you need it.
Thanks but since there was only one version confirmed so far not going to be a big need to post a thread. If I need on for illustration likely have 30 or so examples in picture for currently. Took a couple of pictures of one pulled a couple days ago from a 6R165xxx
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Jeff: On the 65-66 SJ pads, have you seen variances in the surface appearance? I've seen some that look 'flat' and some that are 'shiny/smooth'.
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Jeff: On the 65-66 SJ pads, have you seen variances in the surface appearance? I've seen some that look 'flat' and some that are 'shiny/smooth'.
Most of the time there is a light or thick coat of dust and little particles of the padding that have stuck to the visible side. If clean and at the right angle they have a slight shine to them - more of a semi-gloss that I believe is what they looked like when installed originally. You can often find the protected area behind the heater that is shinier/smoother than the exposed area just above the heater for example. If the particles have been on the surfaces for a long time they can bond themselves into that side (possibly in those very hot 120 degree and higher) where its almost impossible to get them all out. I think this is what can also contribute to the flatter and less smooth (not lessening the dimple pattern) visible side.
Some of this may just be a result of poor quality control during manufacturing resulting on the difference. So for me - bottom line there are allot of things that cause what we're seeing and its likely a combination of one or all.
Couple of pictures comparing dirtier and cleaner examples
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-040118203838.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-031217153139.jpeg)
Dearborn/Metuchen surface texture/pattern
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/11/6-210918155659.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-050118190857.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-050118190846.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-050118190832.jpeg)
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In response to a discussion in another related thread I thought I would spend the afternoon going through what I have records of, add to it what has been posted by members and create a graphic to illustrate what we have so far. We have a mid year gap with no data. Will up date once we get more solid info. As usual didn't include examples from restored cars since they are more likely to be replaced or changed out during the process.
Interesting that we see what is considered the typical 66 style version pop up for a short period but not at the end of the year. Guess I need to recheck those examples to see if I can confirm they don't suggest that a PO changed out a different version for the more common - easier to find 66 style. And of course we can't see the back side and the coding often seen there
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/9/6-070218192543.jpeg)
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That firewall pad that I posted with the rectangular knock-out for A/C lines was from a 26A scheduled build date coupe, 178xxx... the gold parts coupe you helped with...
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That firewall pad that I posted with the rectangular knock-out for A/C lines was from a 26A scheduled build date coupe, 178xxx... the gold parts coupe you helped with...
Will add that into the graphic. Think we might collect some new examples since we're reviving this discussion
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Here is a pad off another SJ car. 05L scheduled build date. 5R09A154XXX. Car had AC original but was taken out by the current owner.
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In responding to a related subject the other day else where the subject of the mold mark on the back (unseen once installed) came up. Not enough samples to make an educated guess as to their decoding - most likely related to plant, time of production and or mold
Thought they should be added to this older thread to keep things together
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/15/6-110521180105.jpeg)
For orientation. The "markings" have been found in other locations during different time periods
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/15/6-110521152337.jpeg)