Topic: what determines a 67/68 a GT?

[priceless]

What does a person need to look for on a 67/68 to determine if it's a true GT? I know that some original invoices say,"GT package". But some don't. So, what do we look for on a Mustang for tell-tell signs of a GT Mustang. Thanks

[midlife]

A marti report (www.martiautoworks.com) is a bullet-proof method of 1967 on up car designations and accessories as ordered from Ford.

[67gta289]

+1 on the Marti.

According to the Ford Buyer's Digest of 1967, the GT Equipment Group "Makes Mustang even more the "Car-man's Car" with more performance gusto. Available on any model. Includes Front Power Disc Brakes, 4" Fog Lamps, Special Low-Restriction Dual Exhaust System and chromed "quad" exhaust outlets with the 271- or 320-hp V-8, GT Side Stripes, GE ornamentation on gas cap, special Wide-Oval tires, higher-rate springs and shocks and stablizer bar. $205.05".

Per the same digest, a few related items from the order list:

289-cu. in., 200-hp V-8 $105.63
289-cu. in., 225-hp V-8 $158.478
289-cu. in., 271-hp V-8 (with GT Equipment Group only) $433.55
390-cu-in., 320-hp V-8 $263.71
Cruise-O-Matic with 200-, 225-hp V-8 $197.89
Cruise-O-Matic with 271-, 320-hp V-8 $220.17
GT Equipment Group (with V-8's only) $205.05
Competition Handling Package (with GT Equipment Group only) $388.53

Note that any V-8 (even the 289-2V) was available with the GT.
In 1967 (only) a GT with an automatic transmission was badged as a GTA on the fenders, GT on the gas cap.
Standard gas cap was twist on; the pop-open cap was included with the optional exterior decor group.
The interior decor group (deluxe) and style steel wheels were separate options for GT's and non-GT's.

I've seen only one 1967 with the Competition Handling Package.  Original owner, "Bullet" green fastback, hi-po 4 speed.  The wheels were 15" with full size hub caps (looked like from a T-bird).  Original spare tire.

[CharlesTurner]

Ironically, as we have discovered a long time ago... dual exhaust was not an absolute with the '67 GT package.  Only S codes and K codes had duals.  Can't imagine why Ford would allow an A code '67 GT be made with single exhaust, but that was what you got!

[priceless]

So, does the 67 or 68 have to have disc brakes to be the GT package?...also, funny you mention dual exhaust ....I have a 69 Mach1 351W-2V (H CODE ENGINE) with single exhaust and,,,,,,drum brakes.  I can't imagine why Ford would allow single exhaust on a Mach1 AND drum brakes,,,,Our Mach1 is a true Mach1 too per Marti report. Been in family for 35 yrs also.  Thanks for any info on the GT.

[gtamustang]

A 67 had to have power disc brakes (PDB) to be a GT. Some may say that their 67 big-block GT came with drum brakes; however, the 67 order form does not have a provision to order order drum brakes or override GT features. 67s could be ordered with PDB as an option. I even checked out one that the owner said came with drum brakes only to find the disc brake proportioning valve still in the original place where the rear steel brake line connects to the flex brake line.

In 68, Ford dropped PDB from the GT group, thus a GT could get drum brakes. PDB still remained an option. The 68.5 428 required PDB.

Regards,
Pete Morgan

[Panther]

I have a question about the combination of the different engines with the GT Equiptment Group:
As 67gta289 wrote, the K-Code had to be a real GT.
Now my problem is about the 390 engine: In some books it looks like the S-Code was always a GT, because of the nomenclature of the engine:
Colin Date's "Original Mustang 1967-1970" says: "Optional Equipment Engine: S-Code (GT)" (see page 41)
The Mustang 1964,5-1973 Restoration Guide (Corcoran and Davis) is listing the different engine types and Engine ID Tag Codes on page 134-135: every S-Code Engine is called 390GT
edit: even mustang decoders like the classic mustang decoder (http://www.mustangdecoder.com) state the engine as an: "390 4v V8 GT"

In my opinion, the S-Code was not always a GT. I've seen the Marti Reports of some S-Code Mustangs with and without the GT Equipment Group.
Am i right, that the S-Code did NOT automatically was a GT?
If it is so: Why do they state the 390 in the different books as a GT?
Is the engine name or code ALSO GT, so that this is leading to the misunderstanding?

[J_Speegle]

..................................Now my problem is about the 390 engine: In some books it looks like the S-Code was always a GT, because of the nomenclature of the engine:
Colin Date's "Original Mustang 1967-1970" says: "Optional Equipment Engine: S-Code (GT)" (see page 41)
The Mustang 1964,5-1973 Restoration Guide (Corcoran and Davis) is listing the different engine types and Engine ID Tag Codes on page 134-135: every S-Code Engine is called 390GT
edit: even mustang decoders like the classic mustang decoder (http://www.mustangdecoder.com) state the engine as an: "390 4v V8 GT"

Not a big surprise to find books and articles that used earlier efforts (simply repeating someone elses thoughts/reseaarch) rather than doing their own

IMHO  Ford use of the GT term as part of the engine identifier added allot to these conclusions and assumtions. It was one of the few (unlike engines such as the Blue Cresent, the Challenger.... ) the term also was used, as we know, to decribe a option package also

In my opinion, the S-Code was not always a GT. I've seen the Marti Reports of some S-Code Mustangs with and without the GT Equipment Group.
Am i right, that the S-Code did NOT automatically was a GT?

Correct - there are non  GT 390 Mustangs that were built

If it is so: Why do they state the 390 in the different books as a GT?
Is the engine name or code ALSO GT, so that this is leading to the misunderstanding?

They refer to them that way since Ford did - see above

Yes IMHO

[Panther]

This GT term was quite confusing, now i get it!
Thank you for clearing it up, Jeff!

[Murf]

I have always thought that a "real" GT 68 was built with a 9 inch rear axle.  For instance the standard gear for the GT cars seemed to be a 3.00, 9 inch axle when equipped with a C4 while the same engine/transmission combination in a non Gt would have an 8 inch, 2.79 axle.  Any comment or observation is appreciated.

[Bossbill]

http://www.mustangandfords.com/features/1505-50-years-of-ford-mustang-gts/
Good article with pics of what comprises the GT package thru the years
Google is our friend

As a pullout from this thread in order to put the topic into the correct year:
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=18478.0

I noted the 67 portion of the article was wrong. Richard noted the following:

+1

I caught 2-errors, did you also see two?

And to continue:
The dual exhaust portion is wrong. Only K and S engines sported dual exhaust.
[edit in blue]
The 390 "S" code in regular trim had turn down tips (no rear valance cutouts) and then only if equipped with the GT package did it sport quad tips and the cutout valance.
289 "K" cars were mandatory GT cars so while they also had dual exhaust the mandatory GT option caused them to always have quad tips and cutout valance.
The rear bright molding is a bit off in that the fastback always has this trim, GT or not.

The Limited slip differential question is open  on the Competition Suspension as I know very little about that option and will let others reply. The facts books do not stipulate as std on C/S, but they don't mention 15" tires/wheels either.

On the exterior decor group portion, I'm really unsure about the rear back panel grill as I have little data out in the wild. My old GTA with exterior decor group did not have the grill or any holes to suggest it once did.

[edit to straighten out the exterior decor portion. 2nd edit to clarify the cutout valance/GT option bit ]

[67gtasanjose]

As a pullout from this thread in order to put the topic into the correct year:
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=18478.0

I noted the 67 portion of the article was wrong. Richard noted the following:

And to continue:
The dual exhaust portion is wrong. Only K and S engines sported dual exhaust and quad tips.
The rear bright molding is a bit off in that the fastback always has this trim, GT or not.

The Limited slip differential question is open  on the Competition Suspension as I know very little about that option and will let others reply. The facts books do not stipulate as std on C/S, but they don't mention 15" tires/wheels either.

On the exterior decor group portion, I'm really unsure about the rear back panel grill as I have little data out in the wild. My old GTA with exterior decor group did not have the grill of any holes to suggest it once did.

[edit to straighten out the exterior decor portion. ]

Yes, I caught the exhaust system error AND what else? Why the Rocker Moldings mentioned in the article were said to be NOT part of the GT group. I guess that is partially true but more exact is that they were simply another "option" available on all 65 body & 76 body cars, they were STANDARD equipment on all fastbacks in 67 (except Shelby).

[Bossbill]

Ok, you mean this line:
"Once again the rocker molding was deleted on GT cars too."
You're right. My GTA had the molding as a stock item and it was not removed for the GT option. I see the molding listed on page 6 in the Facts Book's 2+2 description in small type.

I guess I've have my head stuck in the Shelby for too long, which you correctly note does not have the rocker molding.

[dave6768]

I have always thought that a "real" GT 68 was built with a 9 inch rear axle.  For instance the standard gear for the GT cars seemed to be a 3.00, 9 inch axle when equipped with a C4 while the same engine/transmission combination in a non Gt would have an 8 inch, 2.79 axle.  Any comment or observation is appreciated.

My 68 GT J code has a 9" rear, 3:25 ratio, open and a 3 speed manual.

[427Fastback]

I agree with the Marti report....
I am not a concours guy its just not my thing but I do pay attention...Every J code 68 GT I have seen had a 9" rear and welded up shock towers.I personally owned a 67 Fastback "S" code non GT fastback with drum brakes and my friend owns (well over 40 years now) a 67 "S" code 4spd deluxe interior non GT fastback also with drum brakes...
A friend owned a 67 "S" code 4spd non GT convert and I know of 2 68 black "S" code Coupes that are non GT's with black deluxe interiors .There is some interesting stuff out there....