Author Topic: Nice Article - MCA Judging  (Read 3341 times)

Offline BobV

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Offline mikeljgt500kr

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #1 on: October 06, 2015, 04:05:20 PM »
Sounds very complimentary of the MCA judges and system, I am looking forward to experiencing it for the first time (well, since the Lone Star National of 2003, which is probably ancient history) next year at a National so I can "judge" for myself.  I especially like this distinction:   "The truth is, most shows have judging guidelines that are very generic, such as sheets for exterior, interior, engine compartment, and trunk with no specific details laid out to follow. They are judging mostly on cleanliness, not authenticity, which is the problem from a restoration standpoint. These guidelines allow for flexibility and judging bias that drives owners crazy."
« Last Edit: October 06, 2015, 04:07:25 PM by mikeljgt500kr »
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Offline markb0729

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #2 on: October 06, 2015, 05:03:44 PM »
So would a MCA gold card judge apply the same MCA judging standards when judging for a different organization?  AACA comes to mind.  Or does each organization dictate the standards?  Could an MCA judge get into the situation where they see something that would get a point deduction at a MCA judged event and not qualify for a deduction for the organization they are judging for?
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Offline caspian65

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #3 on: October 06, 2015, 06:07:51 PM »
So would a MCA gold card judge apply the same MCA judging standards when judging for a different organization?  AACA comes to mind.  Or does each organization dictate the standards?  Could an MCA judge get into the situation where they see something that would get a point deduction at a MCA judged event and not qualify for a deduction for the organization they are judging for?

They would have to judge within the guidelines/expectations of whatever other judging organization they're participating in.  Their knowledge is really the only thing transferable.
Charles Turner - MCA/SAAC Judge
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Offline caspian65

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #4 on: October 06, 2015, 06:15:53 PM »
Sounds very complimentary of the MCA judges and system, I am looking forward to experiencing it for the first time (well, since the Lone Star National of 2003, which is probably ancient history) next year at a National so I can "judge" for myself.  I especially like this distinction:   "The truth is, most shows have judging guidelines that are very generic, such as sheets for exterior, interior, engine compartment, and trunk with no specific details laid out to follow. They are judging mostly on cleanliness, not authenticity, which is the problem from a restoration standpoint. These guidelines allow for flexibility and judging bias that drives owners crazy."

Most shows simply do not have enough knowledgeable judges and enough time to judge cars on anything more than workmanship/condition and cleanliness.  The Occasional Driven class in MCA usually makes up about 60% or so of the cars at a national show.  If any type of authenticity rules were applied to those cars, it would take a 10 minute per car judging time to over an hour.  Workmanship/condition/cleanliness is a nice way to judge the common cruiser cars, it puts most folks on a level playing field and gives everyone a fighting chance.   The only issue is when some of the newer cars are classed together with cars 5 or so years older.  The 5th and now 6th generation classes are some of the toughest to win an award because it really comes down to how well the car is cleaned and prepared.  No 'restoration' work is really required, so workmanship is off the table.

Good that you'll be judging next year, always a great way to learn and give back to the hobby.
Charles Turner - MCA/SAAC Judge
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Offline mikeljgt500kr

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #5 on: October 06, 2015, 07:03:28 PM »


Good that you'll be judging next year, always a great way to learn and give back to the hobby.

Thanks, but actually, I will be having my car judged, I am no where near knowledgeable enough to ever attempt such judging with Mustangs/Shelbys at any meet, much less a National. :)
I don't always downshift, but when I do it is near a Prius so they can hear me hurting the environment.

Offline caspian65

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #6 on: October 06, 2015, 07:09:14 PM »
Thanks, but actually, I will be having my car judged, I am no where near knowledgeable enough to ever attempt such judging with Mustangs/Shelbys at any meet, much less a National. :)

Nothing says you can't volunteer to be an assistant judge on a team.
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Offline mikeljgt500kr

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #7 on: October 06, 2015, 07:45:08 PM »
Nothing says you can't volunteer to be an assistant judge on a team.

True, and that is how it all started 15 years ago with NCRS……..but……. :)

I think it will be interesting to see how it has all changed since that 2003 Lone Star National when my KR was a car I drove frequently and it was in the driven class and all the prep and restoration things were done by me, (and I paid little attention to any awards and the process in general), and won a Gold, but now that it has had a big, long, ground up restoration and is in the trailered concours I am afraid it will be super serious and not as much fun as the old days before all that.  We will see.
I don't always downshift, but when I do it is near a Prius so they can hear me hurting the environment.

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #8 on: October 07, 2015, 12:09:27 AM »
..............I am afraid it will be super serious and not as much fun as the old days before all that.  We will see.

It often depends on the weather and the work load that weekend. And of course the team your working with :)
Jeff Speegle

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Offline DKutz

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #9 on: October 07, 2015, 12:36:00 AM »
So dumb question.  I love the details of the thoroughbred cars.  My car will never get to that level (unless I win the lottery) but I would love to replicate it as much as possible.  Besides this awesome for u, is there a place to view pictures of a correctly restored 65 fastback, October 64 San Jose.  I love the judging sheets,but I like pictures better...
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Offline caspian65

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #10 on: October 07, 2015, 12:22:24 PM »
So dumb question.  I love the details of the thoroughbred cars.  My car will never get to that level (unless I win the lottery) but I would love to replicate it as much as possible.  Besides this awesome for u, is there a place to view pictures of a correctly restored 65 fastback, October 64 San Jose.  I love the judging sheets,but I like pictures better...

I only know of one '65 model year Thoroughbred car and it was the one I did ('65 K convertible, 2/65 SJ).  There's a '64.5 convertible T-bred and then only other ones I know of for '65 are Shelby... actually a carryover car. 

You're better off searching/asking for pics of cars that have not been restored or maybe partially restored with some original details that are useful for reference.
Charles Turner - MCA/SAAC Judge
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Offline markb0729

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #11 on: October 07, 2015, 01:20:02 PM »
+1 
I've been led astray by the so called "correct" restorations.  You can't trust many publications either.
65 Dearborn Built Fastback
Approximate Build Date, September 2, 1964
289 4V, C4, PS, PB, No A/C

Offline mikeljgt500kr

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #12 on: October 07, 2015, 02:26:57 PM »
+1 
I've been led astray by the so called "correct" restorations.  You can't trust many publications either.
+1, a low mileage, well preserved original car is the only go-by to use.  I am a little surprised MCA doesn't value these kind of cars much higher than a T-bred, they are much more significant and rare, IMO.
I don't always downshift, but when I do it is near a Prius so they can hear me hurting the environment.

Offline caspian65

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2015, 02:48:02 PM »
+1, a low mileage, well preserved original car is the only go-by to use.  I am a little surprised MCA doesn't value these kind of cars much higher than a T-bred, they are much more significant and rare, IMO.

Most of the judges that have been around for a while accept that the Unrestored class is the most important/prestigious class in MCA.
Charles Turner - MCA/SAAC Judge
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Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Nice Article - MCA Judging
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2015, 03:43:48 PM »
Most of the judges that have been around for a while accept that the Unrestored class is the most important/prestigious class in MCA.

+1 :)

Rather spend a half hour (not enough time) with an unrestored car (with a camera ;)  than three hours with a bunch of restored cars.
Jeff Speegle

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