Author Topic: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder  (Read 5763 times)

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 200
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2016, 06:17:42 PM »
Right Jeff, thanks for your time for teaching me about the smog.

Yes, I know my air cleaner lid is not the correct one, not the factory original, but I haven't told anything because there are repros from the most common vendors, so I can get not the original but one that fits the car.
Understand that there were only one nipple in the snorkel in the original car at some time, and later the other nipple in the lid. Yes, I also understood in maybe earlier versions, the larger hose went to the air pump air filter, but later to the other nipple in air cleaner. And also have clear that I don't have the oil cap with the breather to connect the hose between this and th enipple in the snorkel. That's clear to me now, and if I haven't mention is because i think they are easy finds, repros at least, and that's good enough for me since I don't have probably other options.
That been said, I think until here I'm clear.!
So, what's next now..? How to determinate which valve do I need..?

Appreciate your help Jeff.

Josep
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2016, 06:59:37 PM »
Yes, I know my air cleaner lid is not the correct one, not the factory original, but I haven't told anything because there are repros from the most common vendors, so I can get not the original but one that fits the car.

Well you'll need to look for a used original lid over time


Understand that there were only one nipple in the snorkel in the original car at some time, and later the other nipple in the lid. Yes, I also understood in maybe earlier versions, the larger hose went to the air pump air filter, but later to the other nipple in air cleaner. And also have clear that I don't have the oil cap with the breather to connect the hose between this and the nipple in the snorkel. That's clear to me now, and if I haven't mention is because i think they are easy finds, repros at least, and that's good enough for me since I don't have probably other options.

Looked through a bunch of pictures and it appears that both types of 6 cylinder systems with Thermactor used the air cleaner lids with two nipples. In cars with the Thermactor that used the hose to the Thermactor air filter the second nipple was capped and the other nipple was used for the breather connection

Did look at a dozen or so books focused on emission systems from the period as well as my pictures I can offer the following

There were two systems used For lack of a better term I'll refer to them as system A which connects the back fire valve to the engine air filter and System B where the same hose is attached to the Thermactor air filter cover/lid like found on 240 6 cylinders and 67 Shelby's

Looking at pictures of cars originally equipped with Thermactor built at San Jose and I see System B on very early cars and those in the 6R18xxxx though 6R19xxxxx period. I found System A style installed on cars in the 6R12xxxx-6R16xxxx and (similar to your car) in very late cars around 6R226xxx

System A (for our discussion purposes)






Showing hose going around and to the engine air filter lid






System B (for our discussion purposes)




No hose around back of the engine but instead to the Thermactor air filter nipple








That been said, I think until here I'm clear.!
So, what's next now..? How to determinate which valve do I need..?

Would go with the three port for your usage and time period Its likely a used one will have worn finishes (gold dye for the main body and zinc dichromate for the top cover). There are new ones out there but can cost a bit but its cheaper compare getting the plating done/correct. Of course allot of NOS ones are in poor condition after all these years so check condition first. That is likely why those pieces are in the box and not installed on a show car ;)






And something else to be on the look out for

The smog pump valve cover


« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:24:34 PM by J_Speegle »
Jeff Speegle

Anything worth doing is worth doing concours ;)

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #17 on: August 24, 2016, 03:03:17 AM »
Well you'll need to look for a used original lid over time

I'll do, and I also make a call to anybody that could help me finding these parts, that would be great.


Looked through a bunch of pictures and it appears that both types of 6 cylinder systems with Thermactor used the air cleaner lids with two nipples. In cars with the Thermactor that used the hose to the Thermactor air filter the second nipple was capped and the other nipple was used for the breather connection

OK, they just capped if it had not to be in use, but always two nipples, understood.

Did look at a dozen or so books focused on emission systems from the period as well as my pictures I can offer the following

There were two systems used For lack of a better term I'll refer to them as system A which connects the back fire valve to the engine air filter and System B where the same hose is attached to the Thermactor air filter cover/lid like found on 240 6 cylinders and 67 Shelby's

Looking at pictures of cars originally equipped with Thermactor built at San Jose and I see System B on very early cars and those in the 6R18xxxx though 6R19xxxxx period. I found System A style installed on cars in the 6R12xxxx-6R16xxxx and (similar to your car) in very late cars around 6R226xxx

6R12xxxx - 6R16xxxx are much earlier than 6R18xxxx -6R19xxxx, for swapping between systems A and B, then jumped to 6R226xxx (mine is 6R213xxx), just curious.

System A (for our discussion purposes)






Showing hose going around and to the engine air filter lid






System B (for our discussion purposes)




No hose around back of the engine but instead to the Thermactor air filter nipple





Yes, that's what I have noted and showed from the schematics I found around, systems A and B.
My deduction was that if the hose on schematic (system B) was going to air filter Thermactor, from the routing of the hose on the back of the engine, (in the pics showed and since there was not a nipple in air filter Thermactor) could go to the engine air filter nipple (system A).



Would go with the three port for your usage and time period Its likely a used one will have worn finishes (gold dye for the main body and zinc dichromate for the top cover). There are new ones out there but can cost a bit but its cheaper compare getting the plating done/correct. Of course allot of NOS ones are in poor condition after all these years so check condition first. That is likely why those pieces are in the box and not installed on a show car ;)

Right, think the 3 port valve is the one showed in the first pics I posted, so it has to be good.





And something else to be on the look out for

The smog pump valve cover

Yes, small details that I also have to take care of them. Also making a call to anybody that could have in their junk box these missing parts so I can get from them would definitely help me.

Thanks for all that info Jeff, I think we have almost all clear now, we know the routing, the valve type and some other details to take care of, so if you know sources to collect that parts, apart from eBay, I appreciate your information. Unfortunately no flea-markets here, not much chances to really find them here, so eBay, or others, and the possibility of helpful hands from the guys in the forum are my opportunities. Thanks all.!





Josep
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:24:19 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #18 on: August 31, 2016, 07:07:27 AM »
"...Its likely a used one will have worn finishes (gold dye for the main body and zinc dichromate for the top cover).



Am I wrong or description has been swapped..? How I see, top cover is gold dye and body zinc dichromate, is it right.? Just to my understanding...

That being said, are those (red arrows) parts painted the right way.? Shouldn't be plated zinc dichromate..?
And what should be the color for the (yellow arrow) manifold assembly, check valve and "trees"..? Engine blue for all..? Thanks,

Josep
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:24:05 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #19 on: August 31, 2016, 07:17:51 AM »
By the way, I have been able (finally.!) to locate a 66 200 I6 Thermactor system almost complete, and it's for free (many thanks Gene.!). Air pump support bracket and air pump bracket already found. What I'm still missing is the manifold support bracket (C6DE-9B481-A) and the air pump valve scoop cover.

Josep

CORRECITON: today I have found the manifold support bracket and correct adjusting arm.!!!
Just lacking the air pump relief valve silencer, (the one shown is not the one I was looking for).
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:23:56 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #20 on: September 08, 2016, 03:46:46 PM »
Well guys, looks like I am fortunate.!!!
I have found the right silencer for my SMOG system.!!
With that, I complete all the system, so you can imagine how happy I feel.!!
Here's the pic,

Josep
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:23:48 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: Smog 1966 200
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2016, 04:32:44 PM »
Well guys, looks like I am fortunate.!!!
I have found the right silencer for my SMOG system.!!
With that, I complete all the system, so you can imagine how happy I feel.!!
Here's the pic,

Josep

That is really cool! "Far out"! and let's not forget "GROOVY, man!" (just like in the 60's) I hope you didn't spend too much but it is ALWAYS nice to see somebody's ambitions come together like this!

BTW, do you also have the vacuum line & fittings? I do not see them in your pictures. (look at other pictures in all related threads, you should see a thin tubing like a brake line, between intake manifold vacuum source & the backfire valve.)
« Last Edit: September 08, 2016, 04:37:05 PM by 67gtasanjose »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) GTA Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Int./Ext. Decor +many options

2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2016, 04:59:20 PM »
Think you should buy at least one lottery ticket.   ;D
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:23:38 PM by J_Speegle »
Jeff Speegle

Anything worth doing is worth doing concours ;)

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2016, 06:59:41 PM »
Richard:
Yes, I have that line too, in fact, I think I have it all.! Not in the pics but yes, I have it. Well, yes, check my first post, picture #2, there you can see the vacuum line.
Got two SMOGS, one from a V8 at $75 and one from a I6 for free.!
Air pump bracket $40, air pump support brackt $25, air tube support + adjusting arm + silencer $90
Not bad at all.!

Jeff:
I have to.!! Tomorrow I will do.!!

Thanks guys.!

Josep
« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:23:18 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #24 on: September 09, 2016, 03:00:27 AM »
Hello again.!

Just some questions related...

#1 See in the pic above, there are two types of ferrules, on the left a one piece, on the right a two piece ferrules.
Can I use any of them for my application, or does it has to be specifically one of the shown above..?

#2 Also, is there any possibly to get a anti backfire valve diagram..? I would help to determinate how the internal parts moves, to check it's functionality.

#3 Regarding the silencer, I see from this pics different configurations. Looks to me that the right one should be the same as the one shown in that ad, with the two holes facing the front of the car.


Thanks,

Josep

« Last Edit: September 09, 2016, 05:23:07 PM by J_Speegle »
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline J_Speegle

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #25 on: September 09, 2016, 05:22:57 PM »
#1 See in the pic above, there are two types of ferrules, on the left a one piece, on the right a two piece ferrules.
Can I use any of them for my application, or does it has to be specifically one of the shown above..?

Not sure at the moment




#2 Also, is there any possibly to get a anti backfire valve diagram..? I would help to determinate how the internal parts moves, to check it's functionality.

There are training manuals that go through trouble shooting and system basics from the period






#3 Regarding the silencer, I see from this pics different configurations. Looks to me that the right one should be the same as the one shown in that ad, with the two holes facing the front of the car.

Yes it appears in the bottom of your three pictures that it should be rotated like in the first picture and as instructed in the Ford document. Easy fit



BTW dumped the other post so that the info would all be posted under this one heading since its so related
Jeff Speegle

Anything worth doing is worth doing concours ;)

Offline Josep

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #26 on: September 09, 2016, 06:10:58 PM »
Thanks for diagrams Jeff.!

Josep
1966 Mustang Hardtop 200 Inline 6 - Arcadian Blue - C4 - Thermactor - 6R07T213966 - San Jose projected build date June 11th 1966 - DSO 71
1966 Mustang Convertible 289-2V - Vintage Burgundy - AT PS DB - 6F08C109403 - Dearborn projected build date September 9th 1965 - DSO 36

Offline jwc66k

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Re: Smog 1966 - 6 Cylinder
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2016, 06:37:18 PM »
Not sure at the moment




There are training manuals that go through trouble shooting and system basics from the period






Yes it appears in the bottom of your three pictures that it should be rotated like in the first picture and as instructed in the Ford document. Easy fit



BTW dumped the other post so that the info would all be posted under this one heading since its so related
I can see a few ways to trouble shoot both valves with a small hand held vacuum pump and an air compressor. That will only tell you if the diaphragm is intact, the air valve moves and air is deflected. Spring tension and leaks not so much.
Jim
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