ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1964 1/2 - 1965 => Topic started by: trucktricksdon on May 17, 2010, 11:02:38 PM
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I have a November 64 A code coupe and I was wondering which styled steel wheels are correct for it. I noticed some of the earlier cars had silver painted inserts and most later cars had charcoal gray painted inserts. Does anyone know when they started painting the wheel inserts gray? What color would be correct for a November 64 car if it were ordered that way originally?
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Argent was the norm at that time in production.
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Thanks for the info, Charles. I am somewhat overwelmed with all of the questions I have. In trying to put this car back together, new questions keep popping up. It's a lot fun none the less!
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I've searched through and read many posts regarding the the correct Styled Steel wheels for my 65 Fastback with a build date of September 2, 1964. It looks like the argent inset color would be correct rather than charcoal. Can you folks help confirm this for me? I never realized the argent color was so light. I've seen a lot of pictures on the internet showing argent to be much darker (closer to charcoal). Thoughts? Here's a link to what I believe is the correct argent color:
http://www.cjponyparts.com/scott-drake-wheel-14x5-styled-steel-1964-1-2/p/W181-V/
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Yes, would have been argent that early. There are several shades, try locating some in the Motorcraft cans, seems it was the best match and best spraying. Otherwise, the paint code can probably be found to mix up some paint for a gun.
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Thank you for your help! :)
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Would this be the correct insert color for a mid-Oct 64 Fastback as well?
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Should be, all 65 Style Steel Wheels were that color, that's the type that has a chrome outer edge instead of a separate trim ring ala 66 style.
Jim
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The darker silver was introduced later in '65, about the time the GT package came out. Although, with using up the old style and dealers having the old style in stock, it muddies the transition date. Generally, I will accept argent wheels on anything between July '64 and about April '65.
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all 65 Style Steel Wheels were that color
From my understanding there were two colors of 65 Style Steel Wheel, the earlier Argent and later dark Charcoal (?) color. Both had the chromed wheel lip as opposed to the chrome trim ring used in 66.
I put the (?) because I'm not sure the exact name of the later 65 dark insert color. I've heard it called "Charcoal" or "Ralley Wheel Charcoal". I also don't know for certain if it's the same color used on the '66 wheels, although they look similar.
Here are Scott Drakes examples, although I'd trust Charles's date ranges more...
65 before 2/1/65
http://www.npdlink.com/store/products/wheel_styled_steel_14_inch_x-100714-1.html
65 after 2/1/65
http://www.npdlink.com/store/products/wheel_styled_steel_14_inch_x-100736-1.html
66
http://www.npdlink.com/store/products/wheel_styled_steel_14_inch_x-100738-1.html
Thanks all for the help. I wasn't sure where the (approximate) cutoff line was.
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according to my parts book printed in 65 and other MPC
c5zz-1007-A = before 1st Feb 65 SS wheels had Grey painted cavities (seems obvious they are referring to argent/sliver)
c5zz-1007-B = after " " SS wheels had Gray Gold painted cavities
i cant see where the charcoal comes in at all ???, even though scott drake etc all seem to paint them that and everyone says thats the correct color . actually SD wheels 1007-A say their charcoal when obviously they should be Argent/silver/grey , SD argent wheels have a made up number 1007-ARG and his 1007-B say they are charcoal as well ??? although they are not original correct size being 7" wide
afai can see at the moment the only charcoal was on the cavities of GT350's SS mag. not sure what the 1966 SSW (c6zz-1007-A) that use the trim rim cavity colour is meant to be, perhaps they are charcoal?
some of the grey gold wheels i have seen apear to look just grey or darker grey depending on how the light is on them and sometimes the gold shows more if the light hits them favourably . which makes them difficult at times to identify in photo's
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When were the SS wheels introduced? I seam to recall a post where a later date was mentioned ( than Sep 64) May have been a San Jose car, based on an info that the balancing equipment not being available until later fall 64... what factory is yours?
//Claes
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........afai can see at the moment the only charcoal was on the cavities of GT350's SS mag. ....................
What year and wheel are you referring to?
As for the "gray gold" don't recall ever seeing an original car done that way. Does your MOC from 65 show that color or is it only in later versions possibly reflecting a running change in the service parts line? Will check my 67 & 8 versions
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Hi Jeff, what i should have said is the afic see at the moment the closest to charcoal is in the cavities of the gt350 (1966) Magnums. I was just browsing trying to find a wheel where they might of got the colour charcoal from. of course the magnums are black pockets, but up very close they appear to verge on very dark 'charcoal' grey. page 76 of the Definitive Shelby Mustang Guide 1965-1970 by Greg Kolasa has a couple of close up pics and they kinda look dark charcoal (not unlike some pics of S Drakes 1965 SS wheels i see, they are a tad lighter perhaps (also up close in person many repo 1965 SS look very dark grey, not far from black imo). from a few feet away against the contrast of the spoke the 66 magnums look black obviously.
the Gray Gold reference is as it is written in my original parts book printed in 65 (they even made the spelling curiosity of spelling Grey both ways, as i wrote it), it is repeated the same way in later MOC and the last version, without the spelling difference though.
of course it doesnt say how much grey or how much gold is used in the mix but it certainly doesnt say charcoal or dark grey or just grey. i might guess from seeing how some old rims have been restored (they used a different colour underneath which affects the finished colour) that perhaps a coat of gold goes on then a coat of grey, or the other way around. however that is just a passing thought on my account, it may well be one coat of grey and gold mixed together. but surely if ford mention the change from Grey, to Gray Gold, then surely their must be some gold aspect to it
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Hi Jeff, what i should have said is the afic see at the moment the closest to charcoal is in the cavities of the gt350 (1966) Magnums. I was just browsing trying to find a wheel where they might of got the colour charcoal from. of course the magnums are black pockets, but up very close they appear to verge on very dark 'charcoal' grey. ...........
IMHO originals are black in person- have seen plenty ;).
Do we know who provided the styled steel wheels? That might be a starting point. Don't have any anymore or I could post a picture of the stamping that would well us. Don't think we'll find that its the same people as the Magnums
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What is the correct color of wheel paint for my 65 GT Fastback steel style wheels with a build date 29 June 1965 from Dearborn, Argent or Charcoal? I seen where early production used argent but I fall in the middle of the year.
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Charcoal would be the most common from the factory at that point, but if a dealer installed them, could be argent or charcoal depending on their stock.
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+1
I also look into this rather extensively and came up with the same results.
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What is the correct color of wheel paint for my 65 GT Fastback steel style wheels with a build date 29 June 1965 from Dearborn, Argent or Charcoal? I seen where early production used argent but I fall in the middle of the year.
The unasked question is - do the wheels have trim rings, or are the rims chrome plated? If chrome plated (without trim rings), then argent. If trim rings are used then Charcoal, the rims are SG black. In theory, all 65 Mustangs Style Steel Wheels are the Argent colored types, 66 is Charcoal, in theory. As the assembly line data is non-existent, and as dealers made upgrades from stock, a "late" 65 may be either. The only verification is a window sticker or build sheet, which still might not state which color anyway. If you have a choice, use the argent for 65. Less hassle from an MCA judge that way.
Jim
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I have had a few Chrome rimmed with only very aged charcoal paint with no sign of a repaint or any traces of argent. Maybe a later transitional thing?
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The MPC actually calls out a transition date of 2/1/65
Before 2/1/65, "chrome cavities painted grey"
After 2/1/65, "chrome cavities painted grey-gold"
We know the first version was argent, so decide whether or not to call the later color "charcoal".
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Hi all,
I am new to Concours Mustang Forum. Hoping for some assistance from people with more knowledge than me!
I'm almost finished with the restoration of my 1965 Ford Mustang A code. I am trying to keep it as original as possible. The build date is June 18, 1965 out of the San Jose plant. I am going to work/paint on my steel styled wheels. I have read a lot on this topic regarding the color of the inserts. This where I could use some assistance.
I have learned that the transition date on the colors are:
Before Feb 1, 1965, chrome cavities are painted grey (light grey)
After Feb 1, 1965, chrome cavities are painted grey gold (charcoal)
The previous owner had painted the wheels very dark, almost black. I can see the straight lines in the paint where they put the tape. It appears to me that they have not painted the spare tire. The color on the spare looks very light color grey to me, but I figured by June 65, it would have been the charcoal color. I attached a photo of two rims. Thanks for any assistance.
Dave
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Welcome to the site. Hope you find the support and information helpful in your projects related to originality
Search turned up what appears to be the larger of the prior postings. Hope this will provide the answer your looking for
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=1194.0 (https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=1194.0)
Will be merging your post with that one to keep them all together as best possible
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I too am following this subject with interest and appreciate the link to previous threads. I understand the cutoff dates from the MPC and question how they apply to scheduled build dates and MCA judging in concours trailered class. If the wheels could be sourced from dealer stock anytime during the 1965 model years they could possibly be either shade. So what say yee? Would you deduct for the incorrect shade depending upon build date, and what would be an appropriate point deduction if any? I remember from twenty-five years ago that 65 chrome styled steel wheels were accepted thru an October 1965 build date with no deductions, nor any real distinction between shades of argent or gold- gray. I also appreciate the fact that an ongoing effort has been made to continually improve the shared knowledge base to get these cars closer to the way they were built and delivered. Thank you for your answers. Moderators, delete this post if not appropriate.
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Thanks for the quick replies. I?m still learning a lot and these forums help! It seems to me from reading the links that the correct color for my June 65 Mustang would be grey gold (charcoal). I had purchased a can of Accumatch steel style gray (#L - 17540) and it is nowhere near the color of my spare tire (wheel) that appears to be the original color that came with the vehicle. Can anyone tell from the photo on my previous post if the SS Wheel that is not on the vehicle argent or charcoal? Or what color paint should I get that closely matches it.
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I'm ready to paint my styled steel wheels the proper "charcoal" color. Having made paint mistakes in the past...and having searched the site for a clear answer...can anyone recommend a very good, closely matching, spray paint?
I know there are different manufacturers and if my search for a reasonably proper "gold" for my engine bay proved anything...they are all over the place.
Thanks in advance.
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My research for the proper gold paint for aircleaner and valve covers led me to Omni-Fill AP-EGC from NPD.
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Wheel paint also from NPD. https://www.npdlink.com/product/paint-styled-steel-wheel-gray/107681
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Have a somewhat related question; my Dec 64 Dearborn K code coupe doesn't have the original wheels. 14" torque thrusts were on the car along with a spare set of 15" styled steel wheels (argent).
What would the default wheel from the factory have been given the original window sticker and sales order didn't specify anything. I used to think styled steel wheel but now I'm not sure. Plain steel rim with hub cap or?
Thanks, Andy
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Have a somewhat related question; my Dec 64 Dearborn K code coupe doesn't have the original wheels. 14" torque thrusts were on the car along with a spare set of 15" styled steel wheels (argent).
What would the default wheel from the factory have been given the original window sticker and sales order didn't specify anything. I used to think styled steel wheel but now I'm not sure. Plain steel rim with hub cap or?
Thanks, Andy
Basic steel wheels with standard hubcaps. Which was pretty typical especially if the new owner planned on adding aftermarket "cool" wheels. Would not have had styled steel wheels based on what you shared