ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1970 Mustang => Topic started by: Bongoman on March 22, 2010, 07:38:24 PM
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I'm attempting to restore my 1970 Mach 1. The rocker moulding with the "Mach 1" on it is painted a semi gloss black. I understand this is incorrect. What is the correct color for these pieces?
Also, I've read one or two posted regarding whether the body color paint should be "blacked-out" in the small areas between the end of the moulding and the wheel wells. Based on my car coming from the San Jose plant and built in January 1970, can anyone tell me if my car originally came with these areas blacked out?
Last question: The Mach 1 moulding is in good shape but the chrome piece in the top of the passenger side door panel needs to be replaced. Does anyone know where to get the chrome piece without having to buy an entire Mach ! moulding set?
Thanks for any help you can offer.
BongoMan
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I'm attempting to restore my 1970 Mach 1. The rocker moulding with the "Mach 1" on it is painted a semi gloss black. I understand this is incorrect. What is the correct color for these pieces?
The color is called Dark Argent - same color used on the grill trim
Also, I've read one or two posted regarding whether the body color paint should be "blacked-out" in the small areas between the end of the moulding and the wheel wells. Based on my car coming from the San Jose plant and built in January 1970, can anyone tell me if my car originally came with these areas blacked out?
Yes and no. Never seen the fender or quarter panels blacked out at the end of the trim on cars like yours. But - it would have been blacked out between the lower and upper quarter panel trim, front of the rocker panel and rear edge of the front fender. The rear quarter panel black out was typically sprayed and the forward details were brushed. Also rocker panel black out was typically higher on Mach I's that year.
Sorry don't know where to get the trim piece you asked about - maybe someone else can help
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Thanks Jeff!
Regarding the Dark Agrent, is it available from paint suppliers? I read a post by someone who said it needed to be custom mixed. I also just found this link that claims to sell it in rattle cans: http://www.metropartsmarket.com/catalog/classicmustangparts-c25s5.html
Regarding the black-out around the Mach 1 rocker mouldings, between your answer and the pictures you posted in response to imnutz a couple of months ago, I think I understand where the blackout should go.
What do you mean by the statement "Also rocker panel black out was typically higher on Mach 1's that year."? Are you referring to the black out in the door opening sometimes going all the way up to the sill? Or something else?
Many thanks for your assistance.
BongoMan
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Thanks Jeff!
Regarding the Dark Agrent, is it available from paint suppliers? I read a post by someone who said it needed to be custom mixed. I also just found this link that claims to sell it in rattle cans: http://www.metropartsmarket.com/catalog/classicmustangparts-c25s5.html
Haven't tried that paint from them but it might be worth a try and would, if it's usable, be a cost saver. If not, then you will have to deal with having some made up for a spray gun
What do you mean by the statement "Also rocker panel black out was typically higher on Mach 1's that year."? Are you referring to the black out in the door opening sometimes going all the way up to the sill? Or something else?
It appear from pictures of original cars that on Mach Is - that year, that plant that the pinch weld black out did not end on the horizontal surface (like typical through the years)) but was extended up higher to under where the lower panel would attach
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NPD also sells Dark Argent in a spray can.
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Just as a follow up to my questions:
Regarding the chrome on the top of the Mach 1 rocker panel molding, I found that Mustangs Unlimited sells a set of all six chrome pieces.
http://www.mustangsunlimited.com/itemdy01.asp?T1=M71767+01&Category=&catkey=EMUSTANG
Too bad I only need one of the six pieces. :(
Regarding the dark argent color of the rocker panel molding, I found another seller of the paint in a rattle can. Again, Mustangs Unlimited. They call it "charcoal finish" paint but say it's specifically for Mach 1 rocker molding and 65-67 wheels.
http://www.mustangsunlimited.com/itemdy01.asp?T1=A5000+01&Category=&catkey=EMUSTANG
Again, thanks for all the information.
Bongoman
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Hi
I am a little confused when it comes to the correct color for the Rocker Panel Mouldings on my Yellow Mach 1.
My research has confirmed that the Left and Right front Panels are "Dark Argent", however all other panels on my vehicle are Black.
Are all pieces supposed to be Dark Argent or just the front pieces? Was it the same for all colors?
It is difficult to find examples here in Australia to compare with.
Thank you
Ward
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Hi
I am a little confused when it comes to the correct color for the Rocker Panel Mouldings on my Yellow Mach 1.
My research has confirmed that the Left and Right front Panels are "Dark Argent", however all other panels on my vehicle are Black.
Are all pieces supposed to be Dark Argent or just the front pieces? Was it the same for all colors?
It is difficult to find examples here in Australia to compare with.
Thank you
Ward
Many get repainted with black so maybe yours have too. All of the pieces should match. Dark argent is the typical of what I have found on several survivor types I have observed . I have only noticed a dozen or so because this is not my field of study so others may have different input.
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Many get repainted with black so maybe yours have too. All of the pieces should match. Dark argent is the typical......................
+1 Originally painted Dark Argent
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Thank you for the conformation.
What other parts were also painted Dark Argent?
Thank you
Ward
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What other parts were also painted Dark Argent?
Off the top of my head.
- Mach I side molding/cladding
- Grill
- Styled steel wheels
- Possibly the sport wheel covers/hubcap center
- Sport light covers
- Headlight surrounds
On original cars you can find slight variations between the finishes of these parts. May be due to differences in the batches they were sprayed from (painted different places, different days, different batches) or from being exposed to the elements differently
A fairly close mix if your shooting from a gun
PPG/Ditzler Medium Gray Poly DDL33053
Believe most of the part suppliers carry their versions in rattle cans
Hope this helps
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Thanks Jeff
Unfortunately I can't purchase the cans out of the usa because of shipping restrictions.
I will have a local shop mix in accordance with your recommendation.
Another post suggested that the rear honeycombe panel was also Dark Argent.
Are you able to confirm this
Thank you
Ward
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If you ever see a 1970 Mach 1, rare Chestnut Metallic exterior, it is done correctly. Last I heard it was in Queensland. Color matching should help you.
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Another post suggested that the rear honeycombe panel was also Dark Argent.
Are you able to confirm this
Knew I would miss one - will add it to the list above.
Remember that the factory had a similar (to the side moulding) method to blacking out the taillight panel behind and around that panel also
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Thank you for the feed back
Ward
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I had some minor paint work done at shop on my 1970 Mach1. Part of the project was to repaint the black areas (stripes, spoiler, louvers, and lower sides/rocker panel areas). At the time, i did not know about the Argent Black color (mentioned in other threads on this site) so I don't know whether they used the exact correct color, but it appears to be very close, at least. Anyway, when I got the car back, some black paint was bubbled and flaking on the rocker panel covers, so I sent it back for them to redo. It seems as though there may be been chrome or aluminum edges of the ridges exposed originally? Not sure on that.
I'm wondering if anyone has information on 1) what exactly the rocker area looked like originally (plenty of search results online, but I want to be sure of accurate pictures) and 2) the proper way to paint them.
thanks for any help on this!
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First welcome to the site. Hope you find the help and information here useful in your concours related endeavors
Just to be clear your looking for details and pictures showing the finish on the Mach I side cladding (panels) not the rocker panel and other body related details
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Thanks! I appreciate it. Yes, to be honest I was not exactly sure what to call them. From what I can tell, the rocker panel is an actual functional support piece - not a cosmetic part. So yes, that is what I'm referring to.
I'm wondering - should that part be painted over entirely with black, or should there be some chrome/aluminum sections exposed, as it looks almost like there is chrome or aluminum underneath (where the black paint flaked off). I was hoping that some accurate pictures might help.
As an aside, I was referred to this site as a suggestion from a question I posted on the forums.vintage-mustang site, which was - are there any resources out there that have thorough and accurate pictures of what these cars looked like from the factory, in detail? I'm sure Ford has a good stash of pictures, but that doesn't necessarily mean they'll pop up in Bing or Google searches. It would be great to be able to go review accurate pictures of any part of the car, inside and out, as needed when upgrading/repairing/restoring. I don't think my car will win any prizes, but I'd like to try to keep it close to stock if I make repairs, you know?
thanks!
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Thanks! I appreciate it. Yes, to be honest I was not exactly sure what to call them. From what I can tell, the rocker panel is an actual functional support piece - not a cosmetic part. So yes, that is what I'm referring to.
I'm wondering - should that part be painted over entirely with black, or should there be some chrome/aluminum sections exposed, as it looks almost like there is chrome or aluminum underneath (where the black paint flaked off). I was hoping that some accurate pictures might help.
The rocker and funcutional support panels would be body color. The cladding or molding would be decoration at best and mostly painted dark argent. This is the reason I asked.
If you looking for the sections welded to the unibody or the lower section of the door and front fender then where and when the car was built is needed. There are a number of threads already that go into how these areas were blacked out to hide the body color from peeking out around and behind the cladding/molding.
Example
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=656.msg3306#msg3306 (http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=656.msg3306#msg3306)
Cladding/molding is much more standard in finish since it was supplied to the assembly plants prefinished and ready to install. There are at least two versions of the molding so it would be helpful to know which you have.
Looks like the search turned up around 8 threads discussing the molding finishes, styles and differences
Just one ;)
http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=909.msg4677#msg4677 (http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=909.msg4677#msg4677)
are there any resources out there that have thorough and accurate pictures of what these cars looked like from the factory, in detail? I'm sure Ford has a good stash of pictures, but that doesn't necessarily mean they'll pop up in Bing or Google searches.
That is what we hope to accomplish and provide here on this site
And no Ford doesn't have a stash of pictures showing all the details we're interesting in today. They were more interested in production unless there was a special need and focused mostly on one plant that built Mustangs during the classic years.
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Thanks for all the good information, Jeff. The car is in the shop at the moment so I can't check it right now, but from reviewing some of the threads it appears there are some that had a removable Mach 1 section, and some where it was all one piece. I think mine is removable. I'll check it when I get it back, but it looks like its all black in either case, so that helps quite a bit.
My car was built at Metuchen in December 1969, according to the Marti report.
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1970 Mach 1 Rocker Molding. The aluminum is easy to restore in black with Grey on the lettering, but does anyone know how to restore the anodized aluminum? Polish? Is the aftermarket replacements any good? Thanks.
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1970 Mach 1 Rocker Molding. The aluminum is easy to restore in black with Grey on the lettering, but does anyone know how to restore the anodized aluminum? Polish? Is the aftermarket replacements any good? Thanks.
It needs to be stripped, polished then replated a fairly expensive endeavour
Cladding was originally done in a dark argent not black
Going to merge this thread with an earlier one to keep things together and to make it easier for others to find information using the search feature
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I have spent a lot of time working out the details on the rocker trim restoration and black out paint. To begin with I considered the repop aluminum trim and actually had the local mustang shop bring it in and its not very good, two issues the ends of the pieces are not formed correctly and there are NO cutouts in the bottom of them so you can insert the special spring clips that are used to pop rivet them trim to the rocker moldings. I completely disassembled mine, cad plated the special clips, had the trim polished and then use SS pop rivets to install after painting.
Yes the rocker moldings are dark argent and match the parts Jeff has mentioned, BTW the rock shield cover under the grill is also painted that color. Also I had the PPG Med Gray Poly mixed up in their OMNI paint and it matched all my grill, sport lamp covers, head light surrounds and rock shield cover almost exactly, which are all NOS parts I purchased many years ago.
I did not paint my NOS honey comb tail panel and left it the plastic color as its pretty much matches the argent color. BTW Jeff the black behind that tail panel I am pretty sure is the same blackout paint I used on the rocker panels and other blackout areas and not the argent paint as you indicated. I have also attached a picture of that work as I completed it to match exactly to my original blackout on the car.
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Some info here also: http://1970mach1.homestead.com/Blackoutarea.html
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Don't forget, there is a right angle plastic protector strip that goes across the rocker panel trim. Lots of times missing when they are taken off and discarded. I can't think of the name of the vendor but they are reproduced and fairly cheap.
Dan
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Don't forget, there is a right angle plastic protector strip that goes across the rocker panel trim. Lots of times missing when they are taken off and discarded. I can't think of the name of the vendor but they are reproduced and fairly cheap.
Dan
Those are mine: https://www.musclecarresearch.com/63101B62-1
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Ordered the protectors. And, after looking at the links provided (thank you very much) I think I've got it figured out. The highlighting of the letters and the "number1" in what looks like silver in my photos would not be correct and someone's variation years ago. Also noted, the black out color used in the openings between and around gladding at jambs and wheel well lips is not the same as Dark Argent. The Ditzler paint noted, perhaps something like engine compartment paint with 10 to 20% gloss is what I can use here instead of buying another $50 quart of paint. (budget) I've decided to remove aluminum trim, sand a polish with 1000 grit paper, 0000 steel wool and then aluminum polish and a fabric wheel on the buffer. The dings will come out with some work, the scratches and pits a lot harder to get out. It wont be perfect, but it will be original. Also checking out the black color for louvers, spoiler and shaker in another thread. Thanks everyone for responding.
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I have spent a lot of time working out the details on the rocker trim restoration and black out paint. To begin with I considered the repop aluminum trim and actually had the local mustang shop bring it in and its not very good, two issues the ends of the pieces are not formed correctly and there are NO cutouts in the bottom of them so you can insert the special spring clips that are used to pop rivet them trim to the rocker moldings. I completely disassembled mine, cad plated the special clips, had the trim polished and then use SS pop rivets to install after painting.....................
Are all of the cars you posted pictures Dearborn cars or is there a mix. We're starting to mix questions and responses from different plants in the same thread - a concern now and going forward. May need to split the thread or merge different post with established threads
As for the side trim black out on the body remember to reflect on how San Jose applied it rather than the other plants unless there is no choice and your original details were not available to duplicate
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.......................I've decided to remove aluminum trim, sand a polish with 1000 grit paper, 0000 steel wool and then aluminum polish and a fabric wheel on the buffer. The dings will come out with some work, the scratches and pits a lot harder to get out. It wont be perfect, but it will be original.................
Be aware that these will oxidize if not coated so they will require some additional upkeep. Have done the same thing ::)
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Thanks Scott, sorry for forgetting the name, you responded before I could get to my parts to look it up.
For the record I ordered several pieces from musclecarresearch and I was impressed with price, quality and shipping/packaging.
Dan
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I'm posting a couple of pictures here hoping someone may have more detail on the hardware that holds the cladding together. The one pdf file is from Osborn. The bubble call outs are difficult to read. The other photo is the piece that holds the cladding to the door. I have 2 of them and need 12. I cannot find this wire spring connector in the Osborn catalog either. Ideally I'm looking for a complete list of hardware for the Cladding. Thanks in advance.
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AMK has most of the cladding hardware. At least they did when I restored mine. This was probably the most tedious parts to restore on my Mach.
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i to will need cladding hardware.
ive not found a kit for it. do i have to purchase seperate hardware?? mark
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It needs to be stripped, polished then replated a fairly expensive endeavour
Cladding was originally done in a dark argent not black
Going to merge this thread with an earlier one to keep things together and to make it easier for others to find information using the search feature
I had mine restored by King of Trim in CA. All road rash and dents removed polished and then anodized with the correct chemistry. They turned out beautiful. My trim is not painted to OEM paint color, either is my hood stripe.
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Hi All,
I am in the process of restoring my rocker molds and understand this is in color of dark argent.
Would this be gloss or satin?
Many Thanks
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It's a satin/egg shell looking finish like most argents were
Our largest thread on the subject of 70 Mach I side cladding and where I will likely attach this thread
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=909.15 (https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?topic=909.15)
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Don't forget the black out detail behind the cladding applied on the Mach I's before the cladding was attached. Differed slightly depending on the car assembly plant.
Thread on that
https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=656.msg3306#msg3306 (https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=caqf1ev6su2cq63466c9khi732&topic=656.msg3306#msg3306)
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Thanks Jeff for this. Good to know and will do.
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Does anyone have the code for this dark argent? is it DDL33053??
Also is Deep argent the same beast?
Thank you