Topic: Red Dyed Hardware

[J_Speegle]

I have read on a post that phosphate bolts & nuts would be dyed with opaque ink and zinc plated would use transparent ink is this true?

Don't know that I agree with that suggestion or that all of the hardware suppliers even did the exact thing (specific dye product) as other suppliers. It may be governed more by the specific part and the supplier.

For example the brake line clips for some years appear to have an opaque finish while other years they don't always seem to look as "pasty". You can make out the uneven coating (dye job) along the top of the picture where there are runs and build-up in the lower surfaces and bends of the metal where it collected during drying




I've always used the red layout dye like the Dykem product shown below, but as mentioned in an older thread they have reformulated some of their products to an opaque base so you might need to hunt a bit or experiment. Red layout dye might be a different formula




Don't know that it needs to "stand out"  as many original examples don't especially over phosphate

[CharlesTurner]

I use the Dykem dye that Jeff showed.  Usually use a foam applicator and try to keep the same consistency on the surface.

[Blown351stang]

I have found that the transparent dye to work best on the phosphate as well as the zinc silver and gold. The opaque paint doesn't give the right look for the bolts IMO.

Bob have you got any sample photo's of the work you have done with transparent dye on phosphate and gold to see what I should be aiming for?

[Blown351stang]

I've always used the red layout dye like the Dykem product shown below, but as mentioned in an older thread they have reformulated some of their products to an opaque base so you might need to hunt a bit or experiment. Red layout dye might be a different formula

I did try to get the Dykem product but didn't find it here and being a chemical companies won't ship it overseas.

This is what I got.

[Bob Gaines]

Bob have you got any sample photo's of the work you have done with transparent dye on phosphate and gold to see what I should be aiming for?

No photos saved. I use the Dykem product in both bottle or spray form like most everyone else. It has been the go to product that many of us have used for decades now.

[Bob Gaines]

I did try to get the Dykem product but didn't find it here and being a chemical companies won't ship it overseas.

This is what I got.

It makes sense to me now because I was wondering why you were getting a slightly different look on bolts compared to what mine look like but that is because you are using a different product. You might try to order some different examples of items from AMK to use as a guide . AMK products in this regard will give a typical idea of look ,shade etc.to try and copy with products that you can source locally . Holding it in your hand has advantages over a computer screen which may or may not give you a accurate match to tint and shade.   

[J_Speegle]

Bob have you got any sample photo's of the work you have done with transparent dye on phosphate and gold to see what I should be aiming for?

Not Bob but I've got pictures. As Bob stated how useful they may be (considering different monitor settings and so on) is debatable

From a 69 Dearborn car thread


Over zinc dichromate





Can't recall if these were zinc or zinc dichromate




From another project - over phosphate. Appears fresh so that is why some of the surfaces appear a bit shinny. They will dull quickly with exposure to the air and handling



Likely have other examples - just what was handy

[Blown351stang]

Thanks Jeff.

The last sample looks close to this


Maybe your phosphate is a bit lighter so it shows up better.

[Blown351stang]

You might try to order some different examples of items from AMK to use as a guide . AMK products in this regard will give a typical idea of look ,shade etc.to try and copy with products that you can source locally . Holding it in your hand has advantages over a computer screen which may or may not give you a accurate match to tint and shade.

I have used some AMK products and the only red dye items that I have used was nuts and no bolts.









Some don't get much of a coat.

[Blown351stang]

I did a bit of playing around with the inks today to see what I can come up with.
 
First by mixing the transparent ink with opaque ink in different quantity but really just made it glossy and a little transparent.

Phosphate


Zinc & chromate


Next I thinned the opaque ink out and that made it a cloudy transparent ink.

Zinc & chromate


Phosphate




This look like the same as the bolts I took out of the steering box when it was pulled apart.








Chromate


AMK dyeing nut.

[bullitt68]

Great post. I was asking about the S100 finish on some fasteners on another thread I started. I just want to confirm if S100 is the red dye. Just curious if someone has created a list of all of the fasteners that would get the red dye. It would be great if there is a list as I would love to assemble all of the fasteners and do them all at the same time. I am assuming that the dye was added to the fasteners regardless of what finish they already had. Was there a reason why they dyed the fasteners? I did not notice any red fasteners on my car and I did notice that the master cylinder nuts in the AMK kit appeared to be painted red, but I was not sure why.

Have you tried just dropping the fasteners into a small jar of  dye for a while to see how they turn out. Are they supposed to have a painted look of more of a red zinc tinge to them.

Thanks

[jwc66k]

I was asking about the S100 finish on some fasteners -

In general - yes. In practice - no. Ford, and most other commercial companies of that era, were known for being "consistently inconsistent".
Jim 

[bullitt68]

In general - yes. In practice - no. Ford, and most other commercial companies of that era, were known for being "consistently inconsistent".
Jim

Thanks Jim. So how do I find out which fasteners on my car should get the red dye treatment

[jwc66k]

Thanks Jim. So how do I find out which fasteners on my car should get the red dye treatment

The best way is from the pictures Jeff took and threads on the subject. Bob and Charles have made input on the subject a lot as well. The red dye color problem is compounded by Ford not always specifying it's use by the finish code but including the red dye requirement on the actual part drawing which we do not have access to.
Jim

[bullitt68]

The best way is from the pictures Jeff took and threads on the subject. Bob and Charles have made input on the subject a lot as well. The red dye color problem is compounded by Ford not always specifying it's use by the finish code but including the red dye requirement on the actual part drawing which we do not have access to.
Jim

So how do we know which fasteners should have red dye on them? for example in the AMK bolt kits I have I have only seen 2 nuts with red dye for the master cylinder. Any idea how many fasteners on the car could be eligible to receive red dye. Unfortunately I could find no trace of any red dye on any of my original fasteners, but I would like to find out which ones should have the dye. While I am at it I  might as well ask if any other parts on the car may have received any red dye or other coloured dye for that matter. On some other non Mustang cars I have built I have seen some red & green dye present on brake line ends for example