ConcoursMustang Forums
Restoring - General discussions that span across many different groups of years and models => Suspension => Topic started by: ASSET90 on February 16, 2012, 02:53:52 PM
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Does anyone have photos of 69 rear drums so I can see the brushed on blackout? Any help will be appreciated. Thanks
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Here is a reproduced effort
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/69%20GT350%20Restoration/9F02M481897Brakedrumblackout6.jpg)
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/My%20details/BrakedrumblackoutRestored.jpg)
Here is an original (67 example) the rust shows up as orange - must have been the camera settings
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/My%20details/Brakedrumblackout-1.jpg)
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You guys strive for perfection that I can only dream about! Great job, hat's off to you!
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You guys strive for perfection that I can only dream about! ...
Oh you can have it if you want it ;) We're here for help and support
As a NOTE - The blackout appears to be dependent on what wheels were ordered - typically styled steel wheels received this in 69.
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Thanks Jeff, That is exactly what I was looking for!
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The sloppy application of the blackout looks good....on this one I did a few years ago it was probably not sloppy enough. You also could/should machine the edge of the drum and the groove if you want it to look correct. The edge of the drum especially stands out nice when looking on the underside when everything is assembled again.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z213/azscj/P9220410.jpg)
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The sloppy application of the blackout looks good....on this one I did a few years ago it was probably not sloppy enough. You also could/should machine the edge of the drum and the groove if you want it to look correct. The edge of the drum especially stands out nice when looking on the underside when everything is assembled again.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z213/azscj/P9220410.jpg)
As Marcus relates the blackout is too nice compared to assemblyline however the The groove detail and edge detail is spot on. Nice job!
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Was this same blackout also done in 1970? (car is a May 70 Dearborn build Boss 2)
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Was this same blackout also done in 1970? (car is a May 70 Dearborn build Boss 2)
Guess we should have made it clear from the beginning
The blackout appears to be dependent on what wheels were ordered - typically styled steel wheels received this. Which for you (70 owner) would mean (as I understand it) magnums
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Thank you.. makes perfect sense.
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You also could/should machine the edge of the drum and the groove if you want it to look correct. The edge of the drum especially stands out nice when looking on the underside when everything is assembled again.
Whats interesting to me is that those features are not always machined. You will find drums that the groove is actually cast into the drum. Those also seem to have a cast non machined edge as well
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2 vendors
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2 vendors
OK which two and were rear axles assemblies shiped with ot without brake drums?
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The whole rear assembly was all together with drums on & green clips holding them & orange plastic holder keeping brake cables together on complete assembly. On the Dearborn cars I worked on I have seen KH on 1 side & bendix on other & hardware different on brake cylinders between the 2 with flat bolts on 1 & sunken head bolts on the other & both have different ink stamps date type marks & both types rubber adjusting plugs. I see more drums without extra hole type than other version on Dearborn cars. Also later they started stamping date on bottom outside backing plates in the metal.
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What was the purpose of machining the edge after the blackout application and what was the function of the groove?
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What was the purpose of machining the edge after the blackout application ...........
Never seen the black out get anywhere near the machined surfaces (only to the face and very sloppy )
.........and what was the function of the groove?
Don't know and I'm not an engineer ;) I normally don't talk to workers that made those choices
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On the Dearborn cars I worked on I have seen KH on 1 side & bendix on other & hardware different on brake cylinders between the 2 with flat bolts on 1 & sunken head bolts on the other & both have different ink stamps date type marks & both types rubber adjusting plugs. I see more drums without extra hole type than other version on Dearborn cars. Also later they started stamping date on bottom outside backing plates in the metal.
Current car I am working on, 9F03R48 1880, is exactly like that. I think the recessed wheel cyl head and 8Axxxx plug are on the bendix side. Both brake drums are identical as far as no machine marks
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Don't know and I'm not an engineer ;) I normally don't talk to workers that made those choices
I would think it was to allow the drum to cool more evenly so as to control warpage
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I'm working on my rear end right now. My drums appear to be original to the car. They are date coded 9C21 and 9C26 with the car being built 5/12/69 at San Jose.
The blackout is applied to the face of the drum with a maximum of about a half inch over the edges. Obviously brush painted. The blackout appears to have been done on mine prior to the green clips being put on.
There is also no machined lip.
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Pictures? If its still the original black out that you can see on there would be a nice reference as everything I have the black out is long gone now.
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Pictures? If its still the original black out that you can see on there would be a nice reference as everything I have the black out is long gone now.
I'll get some pics as soon as my camera charges up.
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Here are some pics.
Looking at the direction the runs are traveling it would appear that they were painted with the balance weights mostly[nb]one drum looks as if it may have been turned while being painted[/nb] at the 12 o'clock position. May be coincidental. The paint is cracked and checked where it was pooled and in the runs. Leads me to believe the paint used was lacquer.
The drums have FOMOCO B64 and date code cast into them. Car has Kelsey Hayes backing plates.
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Good pictures....nice.
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After getting the drums back from walnut blasting, they do in fact have lightly machined edges. They did not bother to machine out all the low spots in the cast however.
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ASSET90 Says rear drums. Was this procedure only on the rear drums of styled steel wheels or front and rear drums. As my 69 has front drums also. Thanks
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ASSET90 Says rear drums. Was this procedure only on the rear drums of styled steel wheels or front and rear drums. As my 69 has front drums also. Thanks
Front and rear - there has been some discussion of the possibility of rotors also in 69 but looking for more evidence
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Jeff, I was reading this post and you said you wanted more evidence of blackout on front rotors. Here are some pictures of original rotors on number 2060.
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I haven't come across the blackout on the rotors but have come across about 8 or nine times now of black out on the calipers. A friend pointed it out and once I started looking for it I started to find it. Not a self fulfilling prophecy Jeff ;D . I grab these pics because they were handy but have some that can be seen through the spokes of the wheels somewhere too 69/70 Shelby.
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My S code GT/CS came from the factory with front disc brakes and painted style steel wheels. I am always trying to improve the restoration to make it absolute Concours. With all said above, it appears I need to slab black paint on the front rotor hub and brake calipers. I painted the rear drums with a rattle can, but to be correct, it also appears I need to strip the paint and just slab black paint on them as well, but just the outer facing surface. Is this correct? It has never come up when having the car judged at MCA shows. I show this car in the Concours Trailered Division.
Also, I noticed in all the pictures posted above, I did not see any blue paint on the rear axle hubs. I believe I brought this up in another post. Growing up in the San Francisco Bay Area, I remember in the late 60s, early 70s, seeing Ford cars with blue paint on the rear axle hubs. (I spent a lot of time at a cousin’s auto shop). I found blue paint in the hubs when restoring my rear axles and duplicated this. Anyone else find this on un-restored rear axles? I added a couple of pictures before and after below.
Thanks. Mike
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My S code GT/CS came from the factory with front disc brakes and painted style steel wheels. I am always trying to improve the restoration to make it absolute Concours. With all said above, it appears I need to slab black paint on the front rotor hub and brake calipers. I painted the rear drums with a rattle can, but to be correct, it also appears I need to strip the paint and just slab black paint on them as well, but just the outer facing surface. Is this correct? It has never come up when having the car judged at MCA shows. I show this car in the Concours Trailered Division.
The discussion of the black out here as been for 69 (especially Dearborn cars) not sure if it applies to your car.
Not the easiest thing for judges to see at a show but yous should be cast iron color with the brighter machined surfaces and add some more body color to those rear wheelwells and frame rail to cover at least the sound deadener that you painted (red Oxide) over in the picture ;)
As far as the blue on the axle again believe that is not a 69 thing but a 68 thing on only certain rear ends - likely identified one length - one spline
Believe the coupe (long ago ) that was sitting on the trailer in your driveway (J code no GT) had it. Believe I've got one on a 68 NJ built car but can be certain the marks are related
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My S code GT/CS came from the factory with front disc brakes and painted style steel wheels. I am always trying to improve the restoration to make it absolute Concours. With all said above, it appears I need to slab black paint on the front rotor hub and brake calipers. I painted the rear drums with a rattle can, but to be correct, it also appears I need to strip the paint and just slab black paint on them as well, but just the outer facing surface. Is this correct? It has never come up when having the car judged at MCA shows. I show this car in the Concours Trailered Division.
Also, I noticed in all the pictures posted above, I did not see any blue paint on the rear axle hubs. I believe I brought this up in another post. Growing up in the San Francisco Bay Area, I remember in the late 60s, early 70s, seeing Ford cars with blue paint on the rear axle hubs. (I spent a lot of time at a cousin’s auto shop). I found blue paint in the hubs when restoring my rear axles and duplicated this. Anyone else find this on un-restored rear axles? I added a couple of pictures before and after below.
Thanks. Mike
I have only ever found evidence of the black out on the calipers on 69 Shelby's . The thought is because the standard spoke 69/70 Shelby wheel showed more of the caliper then a magnum type wheel. I don't think it was considered until the 69 production year.Mike, if the point is to be relatively historically correct then your paint on the rear drums is excessive. Just the face was painted if at all. It was painted with a brush and not spray painted so brush strokes should be evident on the edges of the face and to a lesser extent the sides. The typically majority of the sides of the brake drum are cast iron finish.
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Agree with Bob here....the face of the drum only would have some blackout paint....added on sloppy and with brushed on appearance. You dont want to paint the entire drum black on the outside.
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What was the purpose of machining the edge after the blackout application and what was the function of the groove?
Drum brakes on GM cars had a coil spring around the outer groove. Most likely for Noise Vibration and Harshness (NVH) issues. Kelsey-Hayes and Bendix produced brakes for each of the Big 3 auto manufacturers. The drums were cast by the millions. There was no extra cost involved in having the groove cast in. The spring probably proved ineffective and was dropped to save money.
I have machined many drums in the past. Many castings were off center. The outer diameter was machined to a specific round diameter to avoid wheel interference issues. The manufacturer had no way of knowing what wheels would be attached to the car.
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Thanks for the info.
Drum brakes on GM cars had a coil spring around the outer groove. Most likely for Noise Vibration and Harshness (NVH) issues.
Would make sense. Kind of the way a rubber band is attached to a brake drum when machined on a brake lathe and for the same reasons.
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I’ve searched and looked in several threads but find this one suitable. I have just dissembled my rear brake drums on my 69 Dearborn built (March) Mach 1.
This is a unrestored picture of the drum black out and white markings on the side of the drum.