Author Topic: Small Block Water Neck/Connection Assy Cylinder Head Water Outlet  (Read 2773 times)

Offline 67gta289

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I was doing a little research and was sorting through a few of the thermostat housing/radiator hose neck, or as Ford called it the "connection assy cylinder head water outlet".  I took pictures, measured a few things, did some MPC research, and put together this document.  It is not very good, but maybe this can help someone.  If there is more information available, we can add to this thread. 

Keep in mind that I can't match the engineering part numbers on the parts in hand with the actual service part numbers from the MPC, but there are some parallels as you would expect.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2019, 06:48:02 PM by J_Speegle »
John
67 289 GTA Dec 20 1966 San Jose
7R02C156xxx
MCA 74660

Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #1 on: March 23, 2019, 03:08:15 PM »
Just to add to your records:

A VERY LATE '67 (early '68?) version that uses a July '67-dated C8OE-B housing exists that was removed from a VERY LATE '67. It has a boss there for a ported vacuum switch, though it has NOT been bored completely through, nor threaded. (for export 68's too?)

This T-stat housing came off a July-67' assembly date engine (7G6Z). FWIW: This is one of those 302 blocks, bored for 289. It also bears a C8AE-A timing cover (with the removable timing pointer; May-'67 dated timing cover). I have been self-inflicted with this knowledge/reality. No axe to grind here, just some stats to offer to those who would be interested in tracking such info.
« Last Edit: March 23, 2019, 08:26:34 PM by 67gtasanjose »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) GTA Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Int./Ext. Decor +many options

2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline Bossbill

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Re: connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #2 on: March 23, 2019, 04:37:16 PM »
The thermostat housing you have marked C5OE ? is probably an "A".

The one I have on my GT350 (which I believe is the original housing) is also a C5OE-A.
The "A" is on the second line, which you can see in this pic and is somewhat obscured in your document's pic.
Bill
Concours  Actual Ford Build 3/2/67 GT350 01375
Driven      6/6/70 0T02G160xxx Boss 302
Modified   5/18/65 5F09A728xxx 347 Terminator-X 8-Stack
Race        65 2+2 Coupe conversion

Offline 67gta289

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #3 on: March 23, 2019, 07:38:32 PM »
Thanks for the replies.  Richard, when you get a chance can you include a picture or two?
John
67 289 GTA Dec 20 1966 San Jose
7R02C156xxx
MCA 74660

Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #4 on: March 24, 2019, 11:10:03 AM »
Thanks for the replies.  Richard, when you get a chance can you include a picture or two?
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) GTA Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Int./Ext. Decor +many options

2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline 67gta289

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #5 on: March 24, 2019, 11:11:26 AM »
That is interesting.  Thanks.
John
67 289 GTA Dec 20 1966 San Jose
7R02C156xxx
MCA 74660

Offline 196667Bob

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #6 on: March 24, 2019, 11:34:49 AM »
Interesting find Richard.

Bob
1966 Coupe, C Code, 3 Sp MT, 6T07C154XXX, Build Date 11/22/65
1967 Conv, C Code, C4, 7F03C154XXX, Actual Build Date 01/31/67
MCA 04909

Offline RoyceP

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Re: connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #7 on: March 24, 2019, 12:38:12 PM »
Hmmmm confused by your statement " This is one of those 302 blocks, bored for 289. " since 289 and 302 have the identical same bore size.


Just to add to your records:

A VERY LATE '67 (early '68?) version that uses a July '67-dated C8OE-B housing exists that was removed from a VERY LATE '67. It has a boss there for a ported vacuum switch, though it has NOT been bored completely through, nor threaded. (for export 68's too?)

This T-stat housing came off a July-67' assembly date engine (7G6Z). FWIW: This is one of those 302 blocks, bored for 289. It also bears a C8AE-A timing cover (with the removable timing pointer; May-'67 dated timing cover). I have been self-inflicted with this knowledge/reality. No axe to grind here, just some stats to offer to those who would be interested in tracking such info.
1968 W code 427 Cougar XR-7 GTE Feb 23 Dearborn C6 / 3.50 open
1968 R code 428CJ Cougar XR-7 May 13 Dearborn C6 / 3.91 T - Lock

Offline Bossbill

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #8 on: March 24, 2019, 02:55:28 PM »
I have one of those non-tapped hole versions and wondered what it was as the bottom number are not legible.
Thanks.
Bill
Concours  Actual Ford Build 3/2/67 GT350 01375
Driven      6/6/70 0T02G160xxx Boss 302
Modified   5/18/65 5F09A728xxx 347 Terminator-X 8-Stack
Race        65 2+2 Coupe conversion

Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #9 on: March 24, 2019, 05:21:45 PM »
Hmmmm confused by your statement " This is one of those 302 blocks, bored for 289. " since 289 and 302 have the identical same bore size.
Understood, I mis-stated...You can change "bored for 289" to "built as 289", in any event it is a 289 assembled in a 302 "C8" block.
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) GTA Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Int./Ext. Decor +many options

2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline 196667Bob

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #10 on: March 24, 2019, 09:52:58 PM »
+1

Just to clarify Richard's statement about "302 blocks being used for 289 engines", for those who may be confused.

At the start of 1967, both Cleveland and Windsor were building 289 engines. Cleveland continued using its C5AE-6015E casting blocks, while Windsor used its C6AE-6015C casting blocks. Sometime around May of 1967, Cleveland, feeling that it had enough of its C5AE-6015E blocks to complete any additional 289 orders for the 1967 Model year, began production of 302 blocks for the 1968 Model year. However, its inventory of the C5 blocks was exhausted before the end of the Model year. Cleveland then turned to using its 302 blocks (casting # C8OE-6015A) and 289 parts, to fulfill orders for 289 engines for the rest of the 1967 Model year.

Windsor, on the other hand, had enough of its C6AE blocks to complete its orders for the 1967 Model year.

Towards the end of the 1967 Model year, Windsor began casting 302 blocks (casting # C8OE-6015B) in anticipation of the 1968 Model year. However, it was then decided that all 302's would be built at the Cleveland Plant for 1968. Windsor still had an inventory of its C6AE blocks that it could use for the 1968 Model year, so it began building 289 engines using the C6AE blocks that it had used since mid - 1966. Once the C6AE blocks were depleted, Windsor, like Cleveland had done the year before, began using the 302 blocks (casting # C8OE-6015B) that it had cast previously, for the remainder of its 289 engines.

Thus the confusion ; one could find a 289 in 1967 built using a 302 block (C8OE-6015A) from the Cleveland Plant, or, in 1968, a 289 engine built using a 302 block (C8OE-6015B) from the Windsor Plant.


Bob
« Last Edit: March 25, 2019, 03:12:58 PM by 196667Bob »
1966 Coupe, C Code, 3 Sp MT, 6T07C154XXX, Build Date 11/22/65
1967 Conv, C Code, C4, 7F03C154XXX, Actual Build Date 01/31/67
MCA 04909

Offline Bossbill

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #11 on: April 05, 2019, 03:16:12 PM »
Hipos too?
Bill
Concours  Actual Ford Build 3/2/67 GT350 01375
Driven      6/6/70 0T02G160xxx Boss 302
Modified   5/18/65 5F09A728xxx 347 Terminator-X 8-Stack
Race        65 2+2 Coupe conversion

Offline 67gtasanjose

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Re: Connection assy cylinder head water outlet
« Reply #12 on: April 05, 2019, 07:13:22 PM »
Richard Urch

1967 (11/2/66, S.J.) GTA Luxury Coupe, 289-4V w/Thermactor Emissions, C-4, Int./Ext. Decor +many options

2005 (04/05) GT Premium Convertible, Windveil Blue, Parchment Top w/Med. Parchment interior,  Roush Body Appointments

Offline jwc66k

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Water Neck - Thermostat Housing, 289 -
« Reply #13 on: September 12, 2021, 04:29:24 PM »
I was looking for some other parts and found an unused water neck/thermostat housing in the box, along with the original one that came on my 66 "K" engine. When I installed a rebuilt water pump, I replaced the thermostat as well. The original water neck/thermostat housing was "moderately" corroded so I installed an aftermarket housing. Here are some observations of the original and the replacement along with the pluses and minuses of the replacement.
To start off, the Ford Service number is C5AZ-8592-C, used from 3/1/65, on 289 engines without the thermostat pocket in the intake manifold. (Prior to this date, the thermostat pocket was in the intake manifold, service C3OZ-8492-A.) It is cast aluminum. The Ford part number cast into the original part is C5OE-8592-A1. (The "A1" is below the "92".) Also cast into the housing are the FOMOCO logo in an oval (on the base of the large outlet fitting that goes to the radiator); Sheffield logo (the casting company, cast on the smaller bypass hose fitting); a number "3" cast near the FOMOCO logo (I believe it's the mold number); a circle type date code with four raised bumps (April?) and 65, the year. The date would be 4 months early for my "K" engine build date of 5H23, but within reason (there may be other raised "month" bumps but they would be in the corroded area). All these identifying marks are located on the underside of the installed housing and are not readily visible when installed. Most visible is a round raised circle, 5/16 inch dia X 1/32 inch high located above the radiator outlet, 1/8 inch from the mounting flange. There are several small casting "flashes" (raised lines from the molds) and that is normal.
On the surface that mounts to the intake manifold, is the recess for the thermostat. It is 2 1/8 inch in diameter, about 1/64 inch deep.
The reproduction part (made by a company whose first letter is "S") fits and is functional. It is cast aluminum. Those are the positives.
It is identified with a number "C3OE-8594" on the base of the large fitting and a pair of letters of the original seller on the bypass outlet. The recess cast in for the thermostat, is the same size as the original - but with a raised 1/16 inch ring that also circles the bypass hose outlet. Those are the minuses.
In judging certain MCA classes, the key quick look for in "originality" is that round raised circle.
Be advised that there are cast iron water necks/thermostat housings that have a raised flat on top of the large fitting used on later 302 engines for mounting a temperature activated vacuum switch. Most of these are drilled and tapped for the switch, others come with a plug, and some are not drilled and tapped. This style was used as the standard Ford service replacement. 
Jim
I promise to be politically correct in all my posts to keep the BBBB from vociferating.

Offline jwc66k

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Re: Water Neck - Thermostat Housing, 289 -
« Reply #14 on: September 12, 2021, 08:01:19 PM »
Pictures for above:
1 C5OE-5892-A
2 A = Sheffeld logo; B = Date Code; C = FOMOCO logo, start of Ford casting nuimber.
3 The "Dot".
Jim
I promise to be politically correct in all my posts to keep the BBBB from vociferating.