ConcoursMustang Forums
1st Generation 1964 1/2 - 1973 - Questions & general discussions that apply to a specific year => 1970 Mustang => Topic started by: Rainier42 on March 13, 2016, 04:00:59 PM
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Would anyone know what the finish is supposed to be for the interior Quarter Trim Screws ( i.e., for Quarter Trim Panel and Trim Corner). This is for a 1970 Dearborn B2.
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Believe
chrome zinc plated small heads
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It seems that there is some controversy as to the type of screw and the finish for the lower screw on the front fiberglass trim panel in the rear seat area on a 1970 sports roof........I was under the impression that the lower screw was a countersunk Phillips with a bright finish (chrome or zinc). Others have suggested that this screw was a pan head Phillips with a zinc dichromate (gold) finish.
Anyone with a definitive answer....please chime in! .....thanks, Mike
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I looked up the rear interior of a 70 Sports roof in the 70 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual (AM 0032 page 38) and if your description of the area of concern is good, the screw is 55934-S9, 8-18X3/4 oval head 17/64 dia , Phillips, with a bright zinc finish. There are 7 on each side holding the panels, looks to be a commonly used screw.
I recommend that you get a set of Mustang Assembly Manuals to assist you with your car.
Jim
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It seems that there is some controversy as to the type of screw and the finish for the lower screw on the front fiberglass trim panel in the rear seat area on a 1970 sports roof........I was under the impression that the lower screw was a countersunk Phillips with a bright finish (chrome or zinc).
That is what I've seen on the upper trim pieces and the front quarter panel covers as shown in the pictures below
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/5/6-140316201339.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/5/6-140316201945.jpeg)
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/5/6-140316203542.jpeg)
Don't know of any other place screws were used - lower edge uses bolts like earlier years
(http://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/5/6-140316204008.jpeg)
Hope this helps
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Jeff, thanks for posting pics. In the 3rd photo the lower screw is the one in question. My feeling is, "typically" on a 70 the screw is a countersunk Phillips with a bright zinc finish as pictured. Does a 69 sportsroof have a different screw in that location?
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The ones on my car are phillips,oval and appear to be chrome. Brian
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Mike on the (69 rear panel anyway) that lower screw hole (in jeffs 3rd pic) that lower hole isn't tapered like the hole above it so that screw isn't tapered & flat on bottom head & a little bigger dome shaped as that panel is thin in that area . I researched this years ago in both 69-70 assembly manuals but never could document this as may have been a running change or plant issue since both 69 & 70 rear panels have c9zb eng #s the upper windlace area was notched out more on 70 to eliminate that 69 little triangle trim plastic. Hard to doc this on a b9 since KK workers added the posi cable on rh side so those rear panel screws may not have all got back in place like at Dearborn plant but lh side should be unmolested area. The assembly manual says in 70 model lite or dark interior screws so has anybody doc a late 70 black int. car with the dark screws change?
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Mike....in my opinion zinc dichromate screws on the 70 panels is not typical or mentioned in any documentation that I have. So I would not put it on my car unless you have some proof it was originally that way from day 1. This is for any of the trim screws in the back interior including the two you were asking about.
I think Ed mentioned he has seen on some 69 cars that lower screw being zinc dichromate and I have seen pictures of this as well on some original cars. But have never seen it on a 70.
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.............. Does a 69 sportsroof have a different screw in that location?
Would not consider even looking since if it does match it still does not confirm what was used in 70 and if different it doesn't effect the outcome either since its a different year and plant
Think you'll find that allot of people share and discuss details but lump allot of years and plants into the mix - IMHO just making the waters muddier :(
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Great info, thanks all!
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assembly manual says in 70 model lite or dark interior screws so has anybody doc a late 70 black int. car with the dark screws change?
Bumping this one, has anyone documented dark (S2) finish on dark interior cars vs the (S9) finish as called out in the Osborne assembly manual drawing?
Specifically asking with reg Dearborn built mid-November 69 with black deluxe interior and also Dearborn January 1970 standard Dark Ivy.
Copy of the assembly drawing with the note on S2 versus S9 finish:-
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- has anyone documented dark (S2) finish on dark interior cars vs the (S9) finish as called out in the Osborne assembly manual drawing?
Copy of the assembly drawing with the note on S2 versus S9 finish:-
The two different finishes "seem" to be a logical choice by Ford for trim screw "55934-Sx" ("1970 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual", AM0032 pg38, items "A" and "D") based on interior color. Whether this was done or not is the question. Assembly lines have been know to "substitute" hardware to "keep the line moving". To further "add confusion", AMK supplies both finishes. There is no help from Ford Car Parts (aka MPC) Soft Trim Section or interior trim illustrations for both 1969 and 1970. (Note: There is no 1969 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual). The accompanying pictures of previous posts do not cover all color combinations.
Jim
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The two different finishes "seem" to be a logical choice by Ford for trim screw "55934-Sx" ("1970 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual", AM0032 pg38, items "A" and "D") based on interior color. Whether this was done or not is the question. Assembly lines have been know to "substitute" hardware to "keep the line moving". To further "add confusion", AMK supplies both finishes. There is no help from Ford Car Parts (aka MPC) Soft Trim Section or interior trim illustrations for both 1969 and 1970. (Note: There is no 1969 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual). The accompanying pictures of previous posts do not cover all color combinations.
Jim
Jim, exactly! I have looked through all my own photos and the Forums unrestored section, and for those showing the quarter panels screws they all appear to be S9 finish. I personally have not seen any S2 on an unrestored example. So the question remains, did Ford ever use the S2 fasteners on the darker finish interiors in 1970?
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To further "complicate" this topic, the -S9 clear zinc verses the -S2 phosphate requirements finish note appears only on the fold down seat diagram (ref "1970 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual" AM0032) page 38 and does not appear on the fixed seat diagram, page 37. (Decisions, decisions.)
Jim
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Updated! I came to the conclusion that many of my interior screws were not correct. I fixed the fiberglass interior trim screw holes where needed. Painted the trim pieces with the correct paint from NPD. I installed the correct AMK fastener kit. I wouldn't have noticed the flaws without this tread bringing it to my attention. Thanks for all the information. Alan
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Attached is a picture of the screws on my Metuchen built car. The upper screw is a Philips pan head screw zinc plated. The hole on the upper screw is worn from removal but the drivers side is clearly not countersunk. The lower countersunk screw is per the assembly drawing. Alan
The S9 zinc finish is what I have observed, but my enquiry was regarding the S2 finish on dark interiors. Has anyone observed this from any plant on unrestored examples?
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The S9 zinc finish is what I have observed, but my enquiry was regarding the S2 finish on dark interiors. Has anyone observed this from any plant on unrestored examples?
Looking at the pictures I have of 70's from all plants and across the year while trying to focus more on the black interior cars, did not find any examples that support a P 7 O finish used on the 70 interior trim panel retaining screws on Mustangs
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Looking at the pictures I have of 70's from all plants and across the year while trying to focus more on the black interior cars, did not find any examples that support a P 7 O finish used on the 70 interior trim panel retaining screws on Mustangs
Jeff, thanks for looking.
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Let me be the devils' advocate.
If a 70 Mustang Sportsroof, or Mach I, with a dark interior, showed up at a MCA judged car show, with the referenced screws having a phosphate and oil treatment, as noted in the 1970 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual, what would you do? Do you have documentation to the contrary? How about the Thoroughbred class?
Jim
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Let me be the devils' advocate.
If a 70 Mustang Sportsroof, or Mach I, with a dark interior, showed up at a MCA judged car show, with the referenced screws having a phosphate and oil treatment, as noted in the 1970 Mustang Interior Assembly Manual, what would you do? Do you have documentation to the contrary? How about the Thoroughbred class?
Jim
Depends if it was a fixed or sports deck rear seat going by the generally available published assembly drawings Jim 😜
Seriously though that is part of the reason I am researching this. A friend of mine had a points deduction in concours trailered for having S2 P&O finish screws on a January 1970 Dearborn built Boss 302 with dark Ivy interior.
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Thought I would post some examples I found on unrestored cars with back interiors from 70 production. From approx 0F12xxxx-0F19xxxx
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/18/6-230623205151-187422107.jpeg)
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/18/6-230623205153-187432406.jpeg)
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/18/6-230623205156-187442105.jpeg)
Since Hopey brought up Jan 70 green interiors will look and post similar cars to try and help that specific focus. Going to be the same though
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70 Green interior examples. As close as I currently have
Early Dearborn car. Likely built around Mid Sept 69
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/18/6-230623232931-187472051.jpeg)
Nov 17th NJ built car.
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/18/6-230623232507-18746395.jpeg)
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The question still remains. Where is the documentation authorizing the substitution of -S9 screws for -S2 screws?
Jim
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The question still remains. Where is the documentation authorizing the substitution of -S9 screws for -S2 screws?
Jim
Jim,
The 11/14/69 revision of the assembly manual dwg # TO-525 (attached again) is the only reference I have found to S2 finish screws being used on dark interiors, supported of course by the availability of said same reproduction fastener kit from AMK.
However from the photographic evidence Jeff has kindly provided it seems that originals were exclusively S9 - with no S2 production fasteners documented so far.
Jeff,
Thanks for checking.
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The 11/14/69 revision of the assembly manual dwg # TO-525 (attached again) is the only reference I have found to S2 finish screws being used on dark interiors, supported of course by the availability of said same reproduction fastener kit from AMK.
However from the photographic evidence Jeff has kindly provided it seems that originals were exclusively S9 - with no S2 production fasteners documented so far.
One. More Time.
If you submit a 70 Mustang, with a dark interior option and all the other "things", to be judged in the Thoroughbred class, with -S2 finish instead of the -S9, and it is rejected - what are the justifications? It there a TSB? Do you have a copy of an assembly line waiver?
I am posing a deep, dark quandary. Are "pictures" enough? Should this "quirk" be spelled out in MCA rules?
Jim