ConcoursMustang Forums
Restoring - General discussions that span across many different groups of years and models => Drivetrain => Topic started by: Anghelrestorations on January 12, 2018, 05:49:52 PM
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I put together a new guide on how to detail a typical Cobra Jet engine especially with the 50th anniversary happening this year of the official release. This is an update of information plus adding some more new information we have not had. The goal here was to review some of the most common items and not go into the internals of the motor.
Welcome to comments, questions or suggestions here.
Its a long article so give it a minute to load on your screen.
http://anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/5/1/2/35122002/cobrajet_engine_detail_v1.3.pdf (http://anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/5/1/2/35122002/cobrajet_engine_detail_v1.3.pdf)
(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4604/39624907042_5be82a1516_z.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/23nw1ms)IMG_5996 Fixed-002 (https://flic.kr/p/23nw1ms) by Marcus Anghel (https://www.flickr.com/photos/154714213@N02/), on Flickr
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Perfect.
A few comments.
In topic #2 : Its missing a J in Cobra Jet.
Under topic # 5. Just a question regarding exhaust manifolds. Did early 70 exhaust manifolds have provision for the choke stove? If not, are they different than 69?
Topic #18. Are distributor brackets the same all years/California emission?
Marcus. You realy have to write a book!
Thanks for what you do and share with us.
John in Norway
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The original “C8” motor mount insulators I have seen have a red ID stripe. I’m not sure how long they continued use of them......
1968 Shelbys have a few other variants as well.
Thanks for sharing this information
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Great in depth article . The best yet IMO. I saw a typo in #8 Engine tag was commonly placed under "coil bracket " bolt . You had dist hold down. #14 FYI the silver color on the valve cover gasket was a sealer . #32 the more common trademark on the bell shaped sender for 69 was FOMOCO in block letters in the rectangle. The Ford script version was less common IMO.
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I posted this over on the CJ forum, but thought I should include it here as well...
Awesome document, Marcus and Bob!
Noted a few typos, missing(?) info, and possibly some corrections to be made? Not criticizing, just trying to help - and gain a better understanding of these details.
Pg 6, #18 - "Distributor bracket" - I believe this should be Ignition Coil Bracket.
Pg 7, #21 - the picture on the right shows a D0ZF-AB carb, but the text beneath the picture describes the 1968 carb in the other pic. I think the '68 carb image may also have lost some of its text.
Pg 8, #22 - I have my original D0 motor mounts, if you want any pics.
Pg 8, #23 - no mention of the different versions of CJ oil pan (C8 and C9) and how they can be identified externally by the baffle spot welds? Also no mention of the windage tray and its variations?
Pg 9, #27 - Alternator fan blade change dates don't appear to match between the text on the images and in the description text.
Pg 10, #30 - wasn't there also a 1970 spacer version that had 4 holes, instead of the double "kidney bean" shapes?
Pg 11, #34c - Aren't BOTH brackets in the picture used for the alternator? The smog pump adjusting bracket is not pictured, but it is mentioned in the text.
Pg 11, #34e - text seems confusing to me... "...except those with AC that had an additional bracket as shown here above." I get the gist of the washer spacer, but what is this additional bracket that's mentioned?
Pg 13, #38 - this describes the 1969 starter cable mounting. Do you plan to add the 1970 starter cable mounting info?
That's as far as I've gotten ~ time for bed. Can't wait to finish reading the rest of it though! Wow!
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Thanks for the inputs everyone.....I needed another set of eyes on this. Will post an updated version in the next few days and update the thread when its done.
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Finishing reading, here are a few other things that caught my eye...
Pg 15, #45e - "The oil cooler bracket was held in place with two special brackets..."
Pg 15, #47 - just me being a picky editor, but I think the image with the fuel pump date code should have the text portion in the same order as the stamped number, for a more direct correlation. "9M8A" stamp / "1969 Dec 8 First Shift" text.
Pg 16, #50 - the C9ZE-E fans have no date code? Mine has a "27" and "u" (greek Mu) stamped in one fin. Is this some sort of inspection stamp and not a date code? Or is mine stamped because it was a service replacement?
Ok, that's all I got :-) Thanks for the excellent article!
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Great story. It is amazing how many experts won't share what they know. This site has plenty of knowledge to share, and willing to. I am glad I am part of it. Everybody keep up the GREAT work.
Chris
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This is a fantastic document! It's going to help me quite a bit, I do have some suggestions though, mostly grammar. Under number 11, it should read, "There were two basic versions..." same applies to changing was to were in the first sentence in numbers 27, 37, 45a, and 50. Also, could a section be added indicating how much of the engine was assembled that received paint and/or parts that are clearly painted along with those that aren't plainly obviously painted?
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Great work, very helpful and well-written.
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I updated the link now to version 1.1 at the beginning of this thread with changes and edits. Let me know if you see anything else in here....certainly appreciate everyone's input and time reading something this long. Next time I will have to do a 6 cylinder detail article to make my life easier.
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Great effort as always. Know how hard it is to keep these articles from growing out of hand as one details is related to another and then another.
Might have added more white space - balance is off from the viewers point and information can look crowded as the eye naturally moves from the top left to the lower right corner of the page and pictures (and in turn details) get smaller because of the lack of space and balance. Just an observation and something that was stressed in my education related to design and layout. Ya my department actually sent me to school for that sort of thing ::)
As an example of one details creating a need for another would be the hose style shown in the PVS pictures. Some may assume that all of the CJ's can with or are correct with the MX marked hoses.
Another detail. Does it look like the attaching bolt heads for the bellhousing to engine are painted in the picture on page 18, Item #58. Seems that if the intake was sprayed and the bell housing below the visible (top side and rear face) part of the bolts and washers would have engine paint on them. Should be able to PhotShop those in to make that go away ;)
Keep up with the good work and thanks for sharing it here on our site
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Thanks Jeff. Points well taken there.
Of all the things the spacing was the most difficult. I could write this twice as fast if I didnt have to worry about spacing. Need to plan the pages out and move things around. Wish I had someone else doing all that for me. But the most important of it all was to have clear updated photos. Nice clear pictures are everything for a detail article.
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Looks great. This will help me with my 1969 Fairlane Cobra project. THANK YOU!
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page #10: The description of the oil pressure sending units is reversed.
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Carl...you are absolutely correct. I missed that. I already edited that one and changed the photos so somehow the description got mixed up. I will change that this week and a few other things and update.
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Updated with some changes now to version 1.3 Changed the link at the beginning of this thread as well.
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What about the windage tray? Couple of versions, too, from what I have read.
CJ and SCJ for windage tray? Thanks
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What about the windage tray? Couple of versions, too, from what I have read.
CJ and SCJ for windage tray? Thanks
69 vs. 70 version . 70 version has cut outs for starter cable eyelets bolted to block instead of the 69 block bracket location.
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I recently added three videos to my YouTube channel. These cover the 1968, 1969, and 1970 Cobra Jet engines since I had them in my shop and just finished detailing them. It was a great opportunity to put together a video showing the differences between the three years and some other common items that I could cover. I split up the video into three smaller videos because otherwise it would be too long to watch coming in at about 45 minutes. So there is a Part 1, 2, and 3. Adding the chapters in each video makes it easy to search and look for a topic that is covered.
Part 1
Chapters of this video:
00:00 - 4:10 Intro
4:11 - 5:03 How to Identify
5:04 - 5:39 Heads
5:40 - 6:16 Blue color
6:17 - 8:55 Air Cleaner and vacuum motor
8:56 - 9:39 Shaker scoop
9:40 - 10:22 Service Decals
10:23 - 11:26 Breather hoses
11:27 - 12:31 Air cleaner bases
12:32 - 13:58 Choke tubes
https://youtu.be/fOcJb3SPHGk (https://youtu.be/fOcJb3SPHGk)
Part 2
00:00 - 1:43 Carb and spacers
1:44 - 2:11 Carb solenoid
2:12 - 3:40 Throttle bracket &return springs
3:41 - 5:58 Coil, coil bracket, and engine ID tag
5:59 - 7:01 Spark plug wires
7:02 - 7:25 Vacuum hoses
7:26 - 8:23 Valve covers
8:24 - 10:09 PCV system
10:10 - 11:03 Brass intake fitting
11:04 - 11:46 Temp sender & distributor
11:47 - 12:46 Fuel line
12:47 - 16:25 Smog system
16:26 - 16:54 Engine ID sticker
16:55 - 17:07 OK valve cover stamp
17:08 - 19:32 Thermostat switch & housing
https://youtu.be/_FUoeerSB-M (https://youtu.be/_FUoeerSB-M)
Part 3
Chapters of this video:
00:00 - 0:56 Oil dipstick and tube
0:57 - 1:40 Oil filters
1:41 - 2:14 Oil filter adapter
2:15 - 2:54 Oil senders
2:55 - 3:42 Fuel pump
3:43 - 4:22 Alternator
4:23 - 5:36 Engine insulators
5:37 - 6:37 Engine to frame brackets
6:38 - 7:13 Exhaust manifolds
7:14 - 7:45 Engine lift hooks
7:46 - 7:59 Exhaust manifold flange nuts
8:00 - 8:46 Belts
8:47 - 9:13 Hoses
9:14 - 9:43 Fans and fan clutches
9:44 - 11:30 Air conditioning pulleys
11:31 - 12:40 Bypass and heater hose connection
12:41 - 13:28 Power steering pumps
13:29 - 13:45 Oil Pan
13:46 - 14:38 Outro
https://youtu.be/YXS4m-gMPWA (https://youtu.be/YXS4m-gMPWA)
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I enjoyed watching the #2 video. I wanted to add some meant to be helpful insight. The thermostat housing placed distributor vacuum switch is made of the same pot metal zinc alloy as the carburetor bowls and bodies. Consequently you color them with gold chromate in the same way as you do the carburetor parts. It is a dipped process and not electroplated. Paint gives a much inferior look on the switch compared to the original chromate coating. The switch can be a little tricky to do because the pot metal portion was dipped before being joined to the brass base. You can tape off or carefully wipe off the chromate from the brass base. Yes careful faux finish painting with appropriate paint will get you by in a pinch but the original process like is done on restored carburetors has the most original look. It takes proper chemicals,a learning curve and time to do them authentically but I am a end user and don't mind.
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Good point Bob. I have never tried that on those switches...but I like that idea. I can give that a try on the next ones I do. The main thing I wanted to point out is that 90% of the ones I see at shows or on cars are just blasted and they dont look good that way and people may not realize what they looked like originally.
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Nice, thanks for sharing!
I know how much work went into getting those engines to that stage, most folks have no idea!
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I just got finished with video #3 which was excellent also . I wanted to mention that the assemblyline bell shaped oil pressure sender for gauges in 69 typically had a FOMOCO trademark in block letters inside a rectangle . All of the service replacements and possibly some 70 units had Ford in script inside the oval. The very early 65,66 and 67 bell shaped senders also had the Ford script in the oval but the base was square and the late 67 on up were hex shaped. I don't know why they changed the trademarks around over the years. In the the Air Conditioning parts explanation I thought I would mention that the adjustable and the fixed idler pulley center bearing cover were different between 68/69 compared to 70. West Coast Cougar has a excellent article on their website explaining the differences and how to replace the bearing . The lower compressor bracket was typically bare cast iron or zinc phosphate from the assemblyline and not painted. They did have the machining marks for the bolt holes like you replicated however. Possibly some service brackets were painted black.Great job .
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For the oil pressure senders I agree and I also show the Motorcraft box vs the Autolite box, but thats what I had in the shop at the moment. So yes a later service piece. Mainly wanted to show why there is two different styles of senders and their application.
On the AC parts and pieces I will do some more research on that. I have to say its not common to get a Cobra Jet engine with AC, but they are not that unusual either so will dig a bit more into that and maybe do a separate piece on that subject.
Appreciate the comments and time spent to watch it all!
:)
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For many of us seeing these great videos is really exciting and helpful - thanks so much Marcus.
I would like to comment on the intended purpose of the distributor vacuum switch in Part 2. It was stated that it was used for emissions. In conditions where the engine was at idle with high ambients, we added this switch to change from ported vacuum to manifold vacuum for the distributor to give the engine more spark advance and a higher idle speed to cool the engine. Switching occurs when the coolant reaches 225 deg F. Once cooled down it reverts to ported vacuum.
I learned a lot - I have a few changes to make.
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On the AC parts and pieces I will do some more research on that. I have to say its not common to get a Cobra Jet engine with AC, but they are not that unusual either so will dig a bit more into that and maybe do a separate piece on that subject.
Great effort and as mentioned a lot of work
Do have a NOS AC parts kit (engine bay kit) for a 390 boxed in 69 if you want to use some details from that. Many of the parts would have been the same while a couple of the items included would be different from assembly line but depends on how far you go as far as parts covered in the article. Easy to start chancing down rabbit holes
(https://www.concoursmustang.com/forum/gallery/20/6-030125191407-208521003.jpeg)
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Well....chasing down rabbit holes is what we do. Have to dig into the details to find answers.
I would be willing to work on something that outlines the AC parts and pieces. Send me a message and we can get together on that if you want. That would be a great start with what you have there.
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Great video Marcus and very helpful. Thanks for putting together such detailed explanations. It is a great reference guide and a must watch for anyone detailing a CJ engine and also a great reference for FE's in general.