ConcoursMustang Forums
Restoring - General discussions that span across many different groups of years and models => Suspension => Topic started by: Anghelrestorations on July 24, 2013, 09:58:43 PM
-
Put together a new write up on master cylinder caps....Jeff you can put in the most appropriate section of the forum site? There is some new information in here....if anyone disagrees or has additional information let us know. Too difficult to post pictures and text in a forum thread, so here is the link with the complete document:
http://www.anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/1/7/6/3176630/master_cylinder_caps_1.4.pdf (http://www.anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/1/7/6/3176630/master_cylinder_caps_1.4.pdf)
I will do a separate one on the master cylinders in the near future.
(http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z213/azscj/DSCN8566_zps3622ce06.jpg)
-
Marcus ,early to middle production 67 used a C6 marked MC decal before the ESA marked one .
-
Ok Bob...that makes sense. I figured since the 66 disc brake caps had the same Caution on a oval sticker this must have been carried over to the 1967 caps.
-
Offer this suggestion related to the following
"—Note: A vent needed to be placed on the master cylinder cap to allow airflow between the cap and the master cylinder gasket as fluid was
displaced. Vents were either on the lip of the master cylinder or on the top of the master cylinder cap as shown in the different year examples below"
Maybe place an arrow to high light this vent or passage in the picture you have posted
-
Jeff - I added the circles on the C9 and the D3 versions to show the vents. You think its confusing how its written now and needs to be pointed out in the C7/C8 section?
I will do a revised version with some arrows and add reference to the sticker Bob mentions here as well and you can let me know if its more clear.
-
Marcus, I have a comparison picture showing a different variation. One of them is stamped with a "W".
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w115/CougarCJ/IMG_0687-1028_zps4b45bf39.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/CougarCJ/media/IMG_0687-1028_zps4b45bf39.jpg.html)
(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w115/CougarCJ/IMG_0686-1028_zpsff35474b.jpg) (http://s174.photobucket.com/user/CougarCJ/media/IMG_0686-1028_zpsff35474b.jpg.html)
-
Very nice write up!! Thanks for sharing!
-
Scott - I have the same version of master cylinder cap stamped with a W and actually another version stamped with the letter P. There is actually some very small detail differences within those caps but they still fall within the years of when the caps were used from what I have seen. It may have been a difference from more than one vendor for the caps during that time.
-
The 67-73 drum brake master cylinder cap(C7AZ-2162-A) is gold in color until installed on the master cylinder in the engine bay, then painted semi gloss black when the engine bay was painted. Is this correct?
-
Actually no, the master cylinder would have been painted before it was installed on the car....not while on the car. The master cylinder and cap together would be painted semi gloss black.
-
just to add that they are not the same shade of s/g black. different paint suppliers & different places.
-
just to add that they are not the same shade of s/g black. different paint suppliers & different places.
? Master cylinder and cap (with booster if so equipped) were painted all at the same time from the same gun. Yes there were different days (not sure how many (if any more than one) different sub contractor plants there were making the same parts there were
-
what i meant was the engine bay s/g & the master cyl. s/g are different shades.
-
what i meant was the engine bay s/g & the master cyl. s/g are different shades.
Now I understand the post :) Thanks for the clarification
-
Thanks too, for the clarification.
-
Ok, made changes as per suggestions, and revised the link in the beginning of this thread as well as here:
http://www.anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/1/7/6/3176630/master_cylinder_caps_1.4.pdf (http://www.anghelrestorations.com/uploads/3/1/7/6/3176630/master_cylinder_caps_1.4.pdf)
-
Marcus, I am having difficulty loading after link takes me there. Tried it on a couple different computers thinking it was software and still couldn't get to load. Maybe temporary . I will try back later.
-
working ok for me.
-
Just checked back and it is working now. Marcus on page 1- "Some time
in 1967 Ford started putting a sticker over the master cylinder caps that called for
their own Ford brake fluid specification (ESA-M6C25-A). " it reads like there were not two types of stickers in 67 . Maybe -In early 67 Ford used a C6AZ-19542-A marked sticker placed on the cap than Some time in 1967 Ford started putting a sticker over the master cylinder caps that called for
their own Ford brake fluid specification (ESA-M6C25-A). -- or something like that . The other thing that i thought I would mention was about the use of the larger C6AZ-19542-A sticker on the 66 style disc brake masters. I have personally never seen a assemblyline untouched master with that sticker and only have seen them painted black with no sticker in wreaking yards ,survivor cars and vintage pictures but my interest is not as wide as some who may have seen them . Late 66 maybe? I did not want to see them overlooked if they were in fact used . Others would know better on that detail. Bob
-
Any suggestions on where we can get the "best" reproduction C6AZ-19542-A sticker? Thanks
-
Bob - I think you are looking at the previous version I wrote (Version 1.3). The new version I put up on my website last night is 1.4 and it mentions the two different stickers in 1967 with a picture of each version. Check again....and I will email you a copy of the latest PDF. Sounds like a possible problem with cached webpages on your computer.
As for the 1966 cap/sticker I was going to put it in there, but I wanted to keep the discussion limited to 67-73 since the caps are physically interchangeable during these years. Actually, I was just interested in 1969 and 1970 but had to expand into these other years because of this overlap.
-
......... As for the 1966 cap/sticker I was going to put it in there, but I wanted to keep the discussion limited to 67-73 since the caps are physically interchangeable during these years. Actually, I was just interested in 1969 and 1970 but had to expand into these other years because of this overlap.
Think that was a good choice - keep it focused
-
Bob - I think you are looking at the previous version I wrote (Version 1.3). The new version I put up on my website last night is 1.4 and it mentions the two different stickers in 1967 with a picture of each version. Check again....and I will email you a copy of the latest PDF. Sounds like a possible problem with cached webpages on your computer.
As for the 1966 cap/sticker I was going to put it in there, but I wanted to keep the discussion limited to 67-73 since the caps are physically interchangeable during these years. Actually, I was just interested in 1969 and 1970 but had to expand into these other years because of this overlap.
OK .
-
So which decal should I use on a late January produced (San Jose) 67 Shelby?
Large with C6 number or small ESA?
Thanks,
Texas Swede
-
So which decal should I use on a late January produced (San Jose) 67 Shelby?
Large with C6 number or small ESA?
Thanks,
Texas Swede
The large C6 sticker is from 66 and I should not have mentioned it because of the confusion in this 67-73 context. The Early C6 marked and later ESA marked stickers are both the same smaller size. I would expect to see the C6 marked sticker on a late Jan 67 car based on what I have seen.
-
Thanks Bob,
Texas Swede
-
Scott - I have the same version of master cylinder cap stamped with a W and actually another version stamped with the letter P. There is actually some very small detail differences within those caps but they still fall within the years of when the caps were used from what I have seen. It may have been a difference from more than one vendor for the caps during that time.
Marcus, great article. I have an original 68 cap that has the W on the top larger sloped surface. It appears to have another letter stamped in the area that Scott's pic has the W. Cant make it out put I will pull it off and look closer. I'll send you a pic
-
Don't want this to take the topic off course, but what would the C7AZ cap be worth, NOS in old blue/gray FoMoCo box? Zinc-dichromate, no paint or decal, perfect condition.
-
Don't want this to take the topic off course, but what would the C7AZ cap be worth, NOS in old blue/gray FoMoCo box? Zinc-dichromate, no paint or decal, perfect condition.
I don't know but typically it is easy to restore nice used ones and once plated and painted it is hard if not impossible to tell from a NOS one. With that said the NOS one although nice to have would not have a extreme difference in value from a restored one IMO.
-
Charles....if you have an original C7 in the box I would be interested in it to add it to my display in my shop.
-
I don't have one to sell, just curious what they are going for. Thanks.
-
Wow, i just dug out my midland for Oz390, and found my master cyl cap had the outline of sticker under a crappy repaint!
(http://i806.photobucket.com/albums/yy342/tim_morrison82/8R01J/brake%20details/master%20cylinder/DSC02190_zpsfcf0ea44.jpg) (http://s806.photobucket.com/user/tim_morrison82/media/8R01J/brake%20details/master%20cylinder/DSC02190_zpsfcf0ea44.jpg.html)
is this a repro sticker? i also found round tabs on the rubber?
-
Any idea where this cap came from/application? Venting appears to be like the 67 version though printing list DOT 3 fluid.
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/mCcap_zpsa3ac6260.jpg) (http://s44.photobucket.com/user/firetrainer/media/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/mCcap_zpsa3ac6260.jpg.html)
Tim - don't recall ever seeing a black decal being offered as a reproduction
-
this is from the car in my signature.
14th dec 67. power disc brakes. the old paint is coming off like rubber in places.
I can also make out lettering under the sticker, but I cant make it out.. I can see brake written. maybe it says disc brake? I will keep trying to read it
-
this is from the car in my signature.
14th dec 67. power disc brakes. the old paint is coming off like rubber in places.
I can also make out lettering under the sticker, but I cant make it out.. I can see brake written. maybe it says disc brake? I will keep trying to read it
I am surprised that the ESA marked sticker would be original on a Dec 67 built car. I would have expected to see a C6 marked decal on this early of a car.
-
Tim, I think your master cyliner lid may be original paint as well as the decal. For some reason the brake fluid attacks the silver ink but not the red . The one on my 67 looks very similar.
-
its possible that some is original paint. if its all original paint, tge sticker would have been painted over at the factory. it started out covered in paint
-
jeff, just had the picture of that cap show up.
I can see much bigger lettering under my sticker. I will try again to read it.
-
jeff, just had the picture of that cap show up.
I can see much bigger lettering under my sticker. I will try again to read it.
I would expect that you'll find it almost twice the size and the same wording as seen in this caps. First one you can make out the wording (67 style and wording) through the decal and the bottom picture shows the wording clearly since the cap has never been installed. Just noticed that the first shot is similar to yours in that the silver area looks black due to the angle or something
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/67-01736MCcap_zps86a11865.jpg) (http://s44.photobucket.com/user/firetrainer/media/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/67-01736MCcap_zps86a11865.jpg.html)
(http://i44.photobucket.com/albums/f49/firetrainer/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/67MCvap_zps494ffb39.jpg) (http://s44.photobucket.com/user/firetrainer/media/Indiviual%20Parts/Suspension/67MCvap_zps494ffb39.jpg.html)
The cap I posted is a puzzle for me as it has the wording from 71-up period yet the venting is from the 67 style. Figured someone might recognize it
-
thats the one Jeff! cheers!
-
The caps I have seen were painted black and then a sticker applied. I have some vintage photos showing same. Disregarding any delaminating silver from age/brake fluid ,I would assume any black paint found on top of the sticker would be from a later application .
-
I would tend to agree that any paint on top of the sticker was put there at some point during its life, not from the factory.
Jeff, I believe the master cylinder cap you are showing is from a Mopar application. Remember, the caps themselves fit the same between certain Mopars and the Ford applications.
-
Jeff, I believe the master cylinder cap you are showing is from a Mopar application. Remember, the caps themselves fit the same between certain Mopars and the Ford applications.
Sure the caps as well as other parts got swapped around allot at the mass rebuilders. Will work in a pinch (until the correct one is found) for someone since the decal will cover the wording ;)
Thanks
-
Marcus, great article. I have an original 68 cap that has the W on the top larger sloped surface. It appears to have another letter stamped in the area that Scott's pic has the W. Cant make it out put I will pull it off and look closer. I'll send you a pic
I just found one with a "W" as mentioned by Tim. When I did a compare to another, I found that the other had the "W" on the inside. Comparing the two, the location and spacing of the stamping is different - I put a ruler up to highlight the difference.
-
I just found one with a "W" as mentioned by Tim. When I did a compare to another, I found that the other had the "W" on the inside. Comparing the two, the location and spacing of the stamping is different - I put a ruler up to highlight the difference.
I would venture to say this later style cap with the channel in the middle was when the transition to the plated the zinc silver. The earlier cap without the channel in the middle was the zinc dichromate. Also the early cap had the C6 marked sticker and the later style lid had the ESA sticker. Of course you can only see the color on the bottom side because the top side is painted black along with the master.
-
Thanks Bob. I can confirm that the unfinished cap in the previous attachment was zinc dichromate (gold) on the bottom side. Most of that disappeared after soaking in evaporust and I ended up removing the remainder manually. For what it's worth (things get changed and moved around) is was on a late 67 SJ Mustang.